Fencing the *#&#ing Law
Ingrid takes aim at potty mouths everywhere, of course, with her track record it might be helpful if she applied the soap and water to her own mouth first.
What’s that you say? You’ve never seen or heard Ingrid say one of those naughty words we all know are on the “thou shalt not say†list that Jesus put together right after the sermon on the mount? Well, that’s very true, unfortunately, she, along with the writers at C?N have used the God given use of language in a much more destructive way, and in a way that is profoundly more anti-scriptural than any word George Carlin ever used.
Since most of the readership of this blog have been in the faith for quite some time most of you are probably familiar with the practice of fencing with the Law. This was where additional requirements were added to the law in order to be extra, extra, extra sure that no one accidently broke the Law. We see Jesus getting really… irritated over this practice in Matthew 15:
1Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, 2″Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!”
3Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?
Matthew 15:1-3
A bit further down Jesus gets even more pointed.
Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. 7You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
8″ ‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
9They worship me in vain;
their teachings are but rules taught by men.’”
Matthew 15:6b-9
Let’s be clear: the words on the naughty list are tradition. They are “rules taught by men†and “traditions of the eldersâ€just as much as the Pharisees’ rules about hand washing were. But, notice what Jesus gets upset about, its not about the mere existence of rules taught by men, or the tradition of the elders, he doesn’t have much to say about those all by themselves. What gets Jesus worked up is when those rules taught by men end up causing people to break the command of God. And that’s exactly what Ingrid, the folks over at C?N and, honestly, much of the church has done in the way they police language.
Check out Ingrid’s check list of mouthly sins here:
I frequently have to delete comments from Christian readers who use words like “su***â€, and cr**. Christians are joining the great stampede toward Gomorrah, and they justify it every step of the way.
That’s right, her check list of mouthly sins involve matching words to a list of naughty words. But is that what the scriptures command? I don’t think so. Check out just a few of these verses:
1Remind the people to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready to do whatever is good, 2to slander no one, to be peaceable and considerate, and to show true humility toward all men.
Titus 3:2
Only let your conversation be as it becomes the gospel of Christ…
Philippians 1:27
Brothers, do not slander one another. Anyone who speaks against his brother or judges him speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it, but sitting in judgment on it.
James 4:11
Therefore, rid yourselves of all malice and all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and slander of every kind.
1 Peter 2:1
Let me ask you, friends, which of those verses have anything whatsoever with the actual words that are used? The answer is less than 1. But the real shame and tragedy of it all is that Ingrid, Ken, the other writers at C?N and, sadly, a whole lot of the church in general take these verses to mean if you don’t use naughty words then you’re good to go. Which is why we’ve got entire blogs that don’t use naughty language, but slander, deceive, and abuse their supposed brothers and sisters in Christ with nearly every post they put up . We’ve seen Ken making up silly names like “the hollow men of the emergent church†and The Ecumenical Church of Deceitâ€. Or we get nasty accusations that emergent pastors â€don’t care for kids†or if there isn’t a handy, catchy news story to riff on emergents with, why not just make something up?
So go ahead Ingrid, whine and complain that Christians are breaking the traditions of the elders, meanwhile you, Ken, C?N and the rest of the watchpoodles out there are breaking the commandments of God with every keystroke.
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29 Comments(+Add)
Piper didn’t seem to have a problem with it.
Tim – I feel slighted, I came up with “Spiritual Pedophiles”, an attempt to describe people who draw away baby Christians but I got carried away with my own creativity.
By the way, the word Ingrid x-ed out I encourage my kids not to say. Sorry.
I’m glad deficate and urinate are o.k. to use. Ken got those on the approved list so we don’t have to use “gutter language” like c#@p.
Actually CRN has aproved of “sucks” and though Ken states he is just quoting someone else… he used “f***ing” in two of his miss(ives) so apparently he approves the use of swear words as long as you use “****” and are not an emergent.
Be blessed,
iggy
Iggy,
I suspect he’d approve of pretty much anything so long as you’re not emergent*
*Emergent being defined as anything and everything he doesn’t approve of.
*Little kid’s voice* “Nan-er, nan-er, nan-er…I’m tellin’…”
Slow news day boys. Time to grow up now…
ANd there it is friends, the Reverend Pastor Teacher, when confronted on his actions by scripture has no answer. Then again, I suppose its easier to just blow it off with a childish answer than it is to confront the reality that what you’ve called a “ministry” and a “calling” has been one long stream of sin.
Sadly, its not a slow news day, its the same old news day.
Tim,
Personally I really try not to use certain words… it has nothing to do with being a Christian, but in how I was raised.
I was raised that one should not swear in front of women and children.
I was raised that one should not swear in public places that someone could be offended.
I was raised to not swear in “church” (even though we really did not attend one as i grew up)
I was also raised to open doors for ladies and other chivalries.
“Ladies first.” is what I am teaching my son.
To turn off my cell phone in movies or meetings of at church. (or at least put it on vibrate)
These though are not in any way some standard of holiness or righteousness or that I am better than others… (though I have been know to tell people to not use profanity in public areas as there are children present… most the time these are teenagers though I have in restaurants and movies done it to adults…)
Again, this is not about how spiritual I am… because there are times I do swear like a sailor… though I am getting better at not doing that. (I am a ex biker… so some habits are hard to fight)
Which is what it is about… in some countries you offend by showing the bottom of your feet to the person you are talking to… this is worse than using the “f” word!
So, do we also need to be aware of other countries social morays or is it just the USA as the standard? If I am hitchhiking in some European countries and hold out my thumb… which means “F*** you!” there… then am I not to give the thumbs up here? Again what is the standard of decency and which country sets it?
BTW… the word crap… comes from the inventor of the “Crapper Toilet” whose name was… Thomas Crapper.
It was that type that is high on the wall with the pull chain… if I remember right.
So so say I am going to the crapper meant just that.. you were going to use the toilet bade by Thomas Crapper… it is like if I said “I am going out to my Dodge Intrepid.” (not that I would use it for that sort of thing!)
Yet it was shortened to me defecate somewhere along the line… but it is funny that it came from someones name and it not is offensive to some! LOL!
Be Blessed,
iggy
Ken,
Slander and gossip are no laughing matters… they are sin not news… so please do not confuse CRN and SoL with those that give true news…
B Blessed,
iggy
Iggy,
I agree, when it comes to edification in speech and action that where you are is where you are, and you should communicate in that way. And that includes the content as well as the mode of operation. Unfortunately what Ingrid can’t seem to recognize is that society has shifting standards. What used to be offensive everywhere no matter what, no longer is, and what used to be acceptable in everyday speech no longer is (especially in the area of race). But that is secondary to the larger issue of the content of what she writes.
Tim,
You confront nothing but your own spin of what you think we do. What you guys see here is actually a mirror image of yourselves.
For example swearing sailor boy above with the patented emerging excuses. Don’t say you haven’t been told.
Tim,
In that they fail to recognize that we are not so isolated anymore… that we are more global than we realize and in that can offend others in ways we might not have even considered…
I light of a “global” understanding… where is this dictionary? How will it work in the Middle East? In Asia? In the Amazon?
We tend to place our own cultural standards as THE standard and miss that all mankind is not righteous… to think otherwise makes God out to be a lair.
That is something I try to teach is that we are all bad fruit… myself, Ken, Ingrid, you… and that is WHY we need Jesus. We have all fallen short the Glory of God… (which is Jesus if one cares for a good Bible study on the topic of the Glory of God)
Yet, some declare their righteousness as less filthy than others and then judge them by their own filthy rags! LOL!
Then they go out and put it on the Internet and call it research and news… when it is gossip and slander and a failing to see they are also sinners saved by Grace…
Be Blessed,
iggy
Yeah but as he pointed out, he’s getting better.
Are you? Or are you still deliberately pursuing sin?
Ken,
Again with the name calling? and you call me childish? LOL!
you expose your heart so much… and never see a thing…
It is a great thing that Jesus has mercy on the blind! (Matt 9:27-28)
I am still praying that God opens your eyes and heart to His mercy and grace, by the power of His love.
Be Blessed,
iggy
Ken,
BTW… you are at this point trying to place a shame based faith on me… I was there once and will never go back as I found Grace in Christ Jesus.
You are in that statement proving what i have stated… You are saying that your standard of righteousness base on YOU is better than mine…
I will not play that game with you… I base my rightness on Christ and find it stinks… I have fallen at His feet and washed His feet with my tears. I have given up my most precious possessions to follow Him.. my free will and pride.
Someday I hope you too can do this… for i am truly a free and blessed man because of the Love of Jesus and no one, not demons, height, widths, depth, Ken Silva, Ingrid… nothing can separate me from His love for me.
So don’t even try… LOL!
be Blessed,
iggy
“I have given up my most precious possessions to follow Him.. my free will and pride.”
He proudly stated in the midst of his self-righteous and pious blether. Seriously, wake up man.
Ken,
You are not harming me at all with your words… which is what this post is all about..
You see I might swear like a sailor, but I am God’s sailor and as he called Jeremiah who also had a dirty mouth… God cleans him so he has me and will even more. I walk in the faithfulness of God and trust in Him as His Word is true…
You on the other hand seem to hide behind a thin facade of self righteousness… and declare it Gods.
You are grieving the Holy Spirit!
iggy
But, “Let him who boasts boast in the Lord.”
2 Corinthians 10:17
Ken,
Isn’t it funny whenever I give praise to God or share my testimony and how great God is you say things like this?
“He proudly stated in the midst of his self-righteous and pious blether.”
Is that what you really think of the works of God in others lives?
iggy
Ken,
I might add I have dealt with demons before who do and say the same and things…
Again… maybe you are really the one pissing (as used in the KJV) on the Blood of not only the reformers… but of Jesus as I speak of God’s glory and you snarl insults and call His working in me “self-righteous and pious blether”?
As I keep saying out of the mouth the the heart speaks and you are bleeding all over! It is better to be covered by the Blood of Jesus than stand on your own blood for righteousness.
It seems that instead of insulting me, you hurl insults at Jesus… and His Grace and Mercy through Love He has shown me.
Oh may you learn of that great love! You would be a changed man!
iggy
Can’t wait for Steve to get back and rein the children.
Stanley,
Amazing aren’t they! LOL!
It’d be interesting to catalog all the non-answers Ken has given on this site, I suspect that most have come when he’s been confronted with scripture. Looks like we can add Chris P to that list as well.
And while you’re at it Tim, would you be kind enough to examine McLaren’s as well.
Chis P has actually been giving some great responses lately. He has addressd the issue, given scripture and actually had a conversation with us. The sam cannot be said for the high-and-mighty exalted on high, reverend elect, pastor-teacher Ken Silva.
Ken,
Pointing out the shortcomings of others doesn’t absolve you of your own. If that were true then Hitler would be our savior instead of Christ.
I apologize to Chris P if I’ve overlooked his responses and thank him for the time and effort he’s put into them.
I found it interesting that in South Africa, it is considered ok, even among conservative Christians, to say the word “sh*t”. Not that I would use that word here, since it is offensive to many. I don’t swear.
The more I think about it, the more I’m like Mr Silva. I don’t swear, I pretty much only listen to Christian music, I don’t drink, I don’t smoke, I agree with Silva’s doctrinal statement. Freaky.
What I have said, I have said. If you can’t hear this reflects on you, no tme. And so now you live with it boys.
Ken,
What you’ve said is nothing.
Ken,
It seems for every praise I give to God you snarl at me… and deny God His glory…
Why is that?
I quote scirpture and you call me self righteous and a child…
Why?
You seem to be against the workings of God… and this thread proves it… your own words condemn you… and all you can do is bring up Brian McLaren to justify your actions against me?
LOL!
You seem to hate me, scripture and anyone that truly gives glory to God in Jesus Christ….
It seems you are truly anti… much…
And you can only say… “bbbbbbut, Brian McLaren!” and yet give no real answer…
That seems to be your only answer and as you stand before God someday for the slander and gossip you have spread in God’s Name… that answer will not cut it.
You need to face you sin.
I do forgive you…
be blessed,
iggy