<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	xmlns:itunes="http://www.itunes.com/dtds/podcast-1.0.dtd"
	xmlns:media="http://search.yahoo.com/mrss/"
	>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: it&#8217;s not me&#8230; it&#8217;s His fault!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/</link>
	<description>Engaging the depths of God and life in the Kingdom</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 19:01:01 -0400</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Alex Jordan</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13740</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Jordan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2007 17:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13740</guid>
		<description>Having read the recent editorial in CT by Aikman on &quot;Attack Dogs of Christendom&quot; (a pretty harsh title and implied characterization) and also being familiar with Ken Silva at the Apprising Ministries website, I believe both have some valid points.

No doubt that civility, courtesy, graciousness and love all ought to mark the speech of Christian communicators.  At the same time, I can understand the urgency and even the frustration of those who feel it is their duty as Christians to point out what they see as error in the theological understanding of particular ministries, errors which may lead those under the care of those ministries into gross error.  

I think that defending sound doctrine is biblical, legitimate and important, and particularly in these days of political correctness and tolerance, when taking a vocal, public stand on principle is often seen as someone being &quot;hateful&quot;.  

Now can our tone be respectful and gentle, even as we are pointing out errors?  I believe so.  But can there are be a place for righteous anger against those who mislead through error, or even for sarcasm that underscores how wrong some errors may be?  I think this is true as well.

For anyone interested, I have written a piece on my blog Jordan&#039;s View, titled &lt;a href=&quot;http://jordansview.blogspot.com/2007/08/age-of-tolerance-calls-for-bold.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Age of Tolerance Calls for Bold Proclamation of Truth&lt;/a&gt;, which speaks on these same issues in more detail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having read the recent editorial in CT by Aikman on &#8220;Attack Dogs of Christendom&#8221; (a pretty harsh title and implied characterization) and also being familiar with Ken Silva at the Apprising Ministries website, I believe both have some valid points.</p>
<p>No doubt that civility, courtesy, graciousness and love all ought to mark the speech of Christian communicators.  At the same time, I can understand the urgency and even the frustration of those who feel it is their duty as Christians to point out what they see as error in the theological understanding of particular ministries, errors which may lead those under the care of those ministries into gross error.  </p>
<p>I think that defending sound doctrine is biblical, legitimate and important, and particularly in these days of political correctness and tolerance, when taking a vocal, public stand on principle is often seen as someone being &#8220;hateful&#8221;.  </p>
<p>Now can our tone be respectful and gentle, even as we are pointing out errors?  I believe so.  But can there are be a place for righteous anger against those who mislead through error, or even for sarcasm that underscores how wrong some errors may be?  I think this is true as well.</p>
<p>For anyone interested, I have written a piece on my blog Jordan&#8217;s View, titled <a href="http://jordansview.blogspot.com/2007/08/age-of-tolerance-calls-for-bold.html" rel="nofollow">The Age of Tolerance Calls for Bold Proclamation of Truth</a>, which speaks on these same issues in more detail.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13364</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Aug 2007 15:20:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13364</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s seems to me that their is a huge difference between what Ken, Ingrid, and others are doing to the evangelical church, (they attack everyone who isn&#039;t their particular bent of orthodoxy not just emergent) and what Paul said and did in the New Testament.   Paul personally established each and everyone of the churches he wrote to.  He had an obligation to call them out and keep them on track.   Equally Paul lived and wrote with a transparency and humility. Ken has not established the churches he lobs attacks against nor does he live with humility or transparency.  

Additionally Ken repeadetly states that he is a &quot;pastor/teacher annointed by God&quot;  which means he is called to a higher standard...Titus anyone?   

Finally Ken uses the standard of the Law to judge others, and well, scripture is pretty clear he is obligated to keep the whole law then.  Not just the pieces he finds convenient for bolstering his stance and argumentation.

I&#039;m in for fasting as well.  Just let me know</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s seems to me that their is a huge difference between what Ken, Ingrid, and others are doing to the evangelical church, (they attack everyone who isn&#8217;t their particular bent of orthodoxy not just emergent) and what Paul said and did in the New Testament.   Paul personally established each and everyone of the churches he wrote to.  He had an obligation to call them out and keep them on track.   Equally Paul lived and wrote with a transparency and humility. Ken has not established the churches he lobs attacks against nor does he live with humility or transparency.  </p>
<p>Additionally Ken repeadetly states that he is a &#8220;pastor/teacher annointed by God&#8221;  which means he is called to a higher standard&#8230;Titus anyone?   </p>
<p>Finally Ken uses the standard of the Law to judge others, and well, scripture is pretty clear he is obligated to keep the whole law then.  Not just the pieces he finds convenient for bolstering his stance and argumentation.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m in for fasting as well.  Just let me know</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: amy</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13294</link>
		<dc:creator>amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Aug 2007 02:41:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13294</guid>
		<description>Rick,
It would be easier to have this discussion if it wasn&#039;t Ken-personalized.  Is abrasiveness okay according to scripture IF one is actually talking about false prophets? I think it is, according to the scriptures I&#039;ve cited, and others as well.

There were certainly people in scripture who were used to communicate God&#039;s wrath - not just in words, but in actions.  Both his followers, and those who were his enemies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick,<br />
It would be easier to have this discussion if it wasn&#8217;t Ken-personalized.  Is abrasiveness okay according to scripture IF one is actually talking about false prophets? I think it is, according to the scriptures I&#8217;ve cited, and others as well.</p>
<p>There were certainly people in scripture who were used to communicate God&#8217;s wrath &#8211; not just in words, but in actions.  Both his followers, and those who were his enemies.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Henry (Rick) Frueh</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13282</link>
		<dc:creator>Henry (Rick) Frueh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Aug 2007 00:19:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13282</guid>
		<description>Jesus is our template. He was angry sometimes and he was compassionate sometimes. It was Joan of Arc that claimed she was channeling God&#039;s anger.

And of course God&#039;s love is bandied about and misrepresented. If you believe Ken shows God&#039;s love or any humility than so be it. We all have a tendency to accuse and excuse according to our own perspectives. I reiterate, if Kimball spoke the way Ken does you would accuse him of being abrasive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jesus is our template. He was angry sometimes and he was compassionate sometimes. It was Joan of Arc that claimed she was channeling God&#8217;s anger.</p>
<p>And of course God&#8217;s love is bandied about and misrepresented. If you believe Ken shows God&#8217;s love or any humility than so be it. We all have a tendency to accuse and excuse according to our own perspectives. I reiterate, if Kimball spoke the way Ken does you would accuse him of being abrasive.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: amy</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13276</link>
		<dc:creator>amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 22:45:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13276</guid>
		<description>Rick,
What I see, for example in II Peter 2 as well as in Jude, Galatians, especially 1:9 is harshness and no hesitation to mince words about those who were false prophets. Not different in tone than the OT prophets, just shorter.

Generally speaking, I believe that the Holy Spirit is in no way an inanimate object just sitting inside of believers. He is the Spirit of God and knows the Father&#039;s thoughts. I believe that a believer can experience God&#039;s compassion, grief, love, and yes even anger.

Generally speaking.

I also believe that what some might believe interpret as &quot;God&#039;s anger&quot; can be coming from themselves.  Likewise, what some might think is &quot;God&#039;s love&quot; showing itself through them can be something else entirely.

In the end however one feels like God is working in them is something that needs to be supported by the Word of God.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick,<br />
What I see, for example in II Peter 2 as well as in Jude, Galatians, especially 1:9 is harshness and no hesitation to mince words about those who were false prophets. Not different in tone than the OT prophets, just shorter.</p>
<p>Generally speaking, I believe that the Holy Spirit is in no way an inanimate object just sitting inside of believers. He is the Spirit of God and knows the Father&#8217;s thoughts. I believe that a believer can experience God&#8217;s compassion, grief, love, and yes even anger.</p>
<p>Generally speaking.</p>
<p>I also believe that what some might believe interpret as &#8220;God&#8217;s anger&#8221; can be coming from themselves.  Likewise, what some might think is &#8220;God&#8217;s love&#8221; showing itself through them can be something else entirely.</p>
<p>In the end however one feels like God is working in them is something that needs to be supported by the Word of God.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Henry (Rick) Frueh</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13260</link>
		<dc:creator>Henry (Rick) Frueh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 15:58:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13260</guid>
		<description>Amy - if Ken held the opposite view than the one he does about orthodox theology would you feel the same way? If he was emergent leaning you would not only feel he was wrong, but you would see that his shrill approach is inconsistent with the qualifications you just quoted.

Read also the qualification as outline by Paul. Where is the longsuffering? Where is the gentleness? Where is the humility? Ken does not envision himself as a pastor/teacher, he acts like an OT prophet. His demeaning &quot;tit for tat&quot; comments are not even adult, to say nothing of Christian.

Read the teachings of Paul, did he spend all his time attacking those &quot;wolves&quot;? Did he even name most of them and did he constantly call them names? Did he say &quot;come and get me&quot; or taunt them with other childish invectives? And who are wolves? Rick Warren waters down the message, is he a wolf? I believe that Calvinism is completely wrong, so are all Calvinists wolves to me?

And when a person claims to be channeling God&#039;s anger through his words then he has elevated himself above just being a servant, he now has been self described as a direct mouthpiece. Ask MacArthur if he would say that. Read Spurgeon and see if he ever made that claim.

Ken has, along with many of us, some important questions about where the church is going, but because he envisions himself as a fire breathing crusader he has lost the most important ingredient, love. Any impartial believer who reads his &quot;missives&quot; can plainly see his self promoting style of name calling attacks, multiple self links, and when you read how he interacts with others in comment sections it becomes clear he displays a disdain and scorn for others.

And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all [men], apt to teach, patient, 
 2Ti 2:25  In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; 
 2Ti 2:26  And [that] they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will. 

We all do well to daily check our pride at the door, for we all have a tendency to think more highly of ourselves when indeed we are nothing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amy &#8211; if Ken held the opposite view than the one he does about orthodox theology would you feel the same way? If he was emergent leaning you would not only feel he was wrong, but you would see that his shrill approach is inconsistent with the qualifications you just quoted.</p>
<p>Read also the qualification as outline by Paul. Where is the longsuffering? Where is the gentleness? Where is the humility? Ken does not envision himself as a pastor/teacher, he acts like an OT prophet. His demeaning &#8220;tit for tat&#8221; comments are not even adult, to say nothing of Christian.</p>
<p>Read the teachings of Paul, did he spend all his time attacking those &#8220;wolves&#8221;? Did he even name most of them and did he constantly call them names? Did he say &#8220;come and get me&#8221; or taunt them with other childish invectives? And who are wolves? Rick Warren waters down the message, is he a wolf? I believe that Calvinism is completely wrong, so are all Calvinists wolves to me?</p>
<p>And when a person claims to be channeling God&#8217;s anger through his words then he has elevated himself above just being a servant, he now has been self described as a direct mouthpiece. Ask MacArthur if he would say that. Read Spurgeon and see if he ever made that claim.</p>
<p>Ken has, along with many of us, some important questions about where the church is going, but because he envisions himself as a fire breathing crusader he has lost the most important ingredient, love. Any impartial believer who reads his &#8220;missives&#8221; can plainly see his self promoting style of name calling attacks, multiple self links, and when you read how he interacts with others in comment sections it becomes clear he displays a disdain and scorn for others.</p>
<p>And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all [men], apt to teach, patient,<br />
 2Ti 2:25  In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;<br />
 2Ti 2:26  And [that] they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will. </p>
<p>We all do well to daily check our pride at the door, for we all have a tendency to think more highly of ourselves when indeed we are nothing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tim Reed</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13256</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Reed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 15:15:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13256</guid>
		<description>I think it was a print-only article from CT.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it was a print-only article from CT.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: amy</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13255</link>
		<dc:creator>amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 15:11:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13255</guid>
		<description>Rick,
If  there were men or women who fit the qualifications of II Peter 3:3-7 and/or Jude 3-19 do you see some scriptural reason why God would not express anger through a servant of his towards those people and their actions?

I&#039;m just wondering if you see a theological problem with 1) the idea of God expressing anger through a person towards &quot;wolves&quot; or 2)you only have a problem with Ken saying that the anger he is expressing is coming from God because a) you think Ken is proud, etc and/or b)you don&#039;t think the men he is &quot;calling out&quot; are wolves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick,<br />
If  there were men or women who fit the qualifications of II Peter 3:3-7 and/or Jude 3-19 do you see some scriptural reason why God would not express anger through a servant of his towards those people and their actions?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m just wondering if you see a theological problem with 1) the idea of God expressing anger through a person towards &#8220;wolves&#8221; or 2)you only have a problem with Ken saying that the anger he is expressing is coming from God because a) you think Ken is proud, etc and/or b)you don&#8217;t think the men he is &#8220;calling out&#8221; are wolves.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tim Wirth</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13251</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Wirth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 13:58:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13251</guid>
		<description>Where is this article at?
The link here takes me to Kens site.
The links on Kens site takes me to CT but not to the article.
When I do a search on the title of the article it shows links here and to Kens site.
Does anyone have a direct link to the CT article.
If so could you send me the link via email or post it here.
Thanks so much.
Tim Wirth</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where is this article at?<br />
The link here takes me to Kens site.<br />
The links on Kens site takes me to CT but not to the article.<br />
When I do a search on the title of the article it shows links here and to Kens site.<br />
Does anyone have a direct link to the CT article.<br />
If so could you send me the link via email or post it here.<br />
Thanks so much.<br />
Tim Wirth</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: jimmy</title>
		<link>http://prophets-priests-poets.info/2007/08/10/426/comment-page-1/#comment-13237</link>
		<dc:creator>jimmy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 04:23:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://christianresearchnetwork.info/2007/08/10/426/#comment-13237</guid>
		<description>Iggy,

Sign me up too...let me know.

Having spoken to Ken, I am convinced that he is a good man...perhaps a bit misguided...but a good man nonetheless.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Iggy,</p>
<p>Sign me up too&#8230;let me know.</p>
<p>Having spoken to Ken, I am convinced that he is a good man&#8230;perhaps a bit misguided&#8230;but a good man nonetheless.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

