As I’ve mentioned in a comment earlier, I actually do fit Ken Silva’s description of a lead guitarist and pastor.  I started playing guitar when I was in college, and since then I have been trying to fulfill my dreams of becoming a rock ‘n’ roll star.  Occasionally, I go to online forums for guitarists where people talk about things like what pickups sound best in my Strat, what distortion pedal sounds best with this amp, was Jimi Hendrix overrated, etc.  Basically it’s stuff that most normal people don’t care about.  Sometimes I think the people involved in these discussion forget why they are there in the first place – to become better guitarists, supposedly.

Where I’m headed with all this is this.  Yesterday Tony Rose posted an article on CR?N that linked to this post on his blog entitled Knowing AND (not “or”) Doing… the Christian Life.  Now let me say from the start that Tony actually says some things I agree with.  I do agree with his assertion that knowing and doing aren’t opposite to one another.  I also agree with point that a proper understanding of Biblical knowledge should spur us on to do more.  My disagreement with his post comes down to the fact that he is still creating a hierarchy where knowledge is placed before and above action.  He says:

Preachers today should follow that model and preach and teach theology, to increase people’s knowledge, in order that they can understand the practical applications of their teachings on Biblical spiritual growth. And then of course, teach Biblical applications and not man-centered ones.

The problem with placing knowledge in a higher place than action arises when we realize that in most things in life, people can’t really learn without doing.  We can read books, hear lectures, and do other things to attain knowledge, but that knowledge remains useless if it isn’t put to use.  The way most people learn a skill go something like this.  First we watch someone do something, we then help someone do something, and then finally we are able to do it by ourselves, and ideally teach others.  The example of a carpenter that he uses is actually a perfect example of this.  For someone to be a carpenter, they must first be an apprentice.  This involves a relatively small amount of book knowledge.  One learns to be a carpenter by doing carpentry.

To get back to my guitar analogy, I look at like this.  I may know chords and scales, I might know all the ins and outs of the gear, and I might even know some music theory, but it’s all useless until I make the choice to pick up the guitar and practice.  I need to get callouses on my fingers, fumble around to find the chords for a while, and then eventually I’ll be able to play some music.  Knowledge doesn’t come before doing, it go hand in hand with it.  Isn’t this what James is saying in James in 1:26 & 27:

Anyone who sets himself up as “religious” by talking a good game is self-deceived. This kind of religion is hot air and only hot air. Real religion, the kind that passes muster before God the Father, is this: Reach out to the homeless and loveless in their plight, and guard against corruption from the godless world. (from The Message)

We can talk a good talk, but if we don’t make the choice to walk the walk, then it’s worthless.  If we know all the right theology, but don’t choose to serve others, what good is it?  The problem with thinking that knowledge is always above action is that it will always give us a reason to delay action.  We can always learn more.

So how much do we need to know before we act?  Not much according to Paul (I’m stealing this from Brant Hansen in this podcast). In Romans 15:14, Paul says this:

I myself am convinced, my brothers, that you yourselves are full of goodness, complete in knowledge and competent to instruct one another.

Now these are the same Roman Christians to whom just earlier in this letter Paul was explaining the basics of salvation!  Now either Paul thought they were incredibly fast learners, or he thought that God would honor their shaky steps of faith.  I think it was the latter.

So today it seems to me that we have the same choice the Roman Christians had.  We can continue to let our questions and doctrinal differences paralyze us, or we can choose to believe we know enough to serve each other and the world.  Maybe once we make that choice, we will find ourselves learning more than ever.

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This entry was posted on Friday, December 7th, 2007 at 10:39 am and is filed under Christian Living, ODM Responses, Theology. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
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6 Comments(+Add)

1   Tim Reed    http://churchvoices.com
December 7th, 2007 at 10:55 am

Not to turn this into a Brandt love fest (but really, can you think of someone better to do that with?) but this reminded me of this post, points #4 and 5.

4) Focus on knowledge, rather than doing

Complexification and expert-class development will make cells spend immense amounts of time studying the work, even debating theories of the work, rather than doing it. Better yet…

5) Equate STUDYING the work with the work itself

The cells are called to ACT, of course. But if we can convince operatives that the work, itself, is in trying to understand the complexity of the work? They’ll be effectively neutered. We need to get them to spend large amounts of time in study, gathering to study, believing they don’t know enough, hiring new experts to teach them again and again, and attending teaching events.

They’ll actually believe they’re doing their work when they attend events held by experts. This will render the cell, and the whole movement, harmless! Convince them that the most radicalized, militant among them are merely called to bring other non-activated members to the cell events.

2   Bruce Gerencser    http://www.brucegerencser.com
December 7th, 2007 at 1:43 pm

Phil,

After going to Church my entire 50 years, being in the ministry for 30 of those years……….I know a lot more than I am doing. This is not a point of pride but a point of fact, and maybe shame. I have preached thousands of sermons now. Taught classes. Preached revivals, youth rallies, camp, etc. I have studied, studied, studied. I have devoured several thousand books., booklets that deal with “the faith” and yet I still stuggle and fight doing “the basic things” of the Christian life.

For me it not about knowledge…………..It is all about doing.

On a lighter note. My three oldest sons are all musicians. Guitars and bass. They play in the worship band at Church. We always allowed to have a broad music experience and they learned to play all kinds of music. A particular jam session at our house could go from bluegrass to 60’s rock to country to Christian rock to praise and worship all in th space of ten minutes.

My one son likes playing 70’s guitar riffs when tuning up at Church. He is always amused by the older Church members who come up to him smiling and quietly say “did you just play___________” :)

With music, my sons definitely know more than they are doing :)

Bruce

3   Tony Rose    http://galatiansc4v16.wordpress.com
December 7th, 2007 at 3:33 pm

Phil,

Thanks for reading my post, and for your comments. I agree with you and think you make some good points here. The only thing I really disagree with you on, is I think you misunderstood my explanation of “knowing,” as you put it, hierarchical.

The words of mine that you quoted, are not properly concluded to mean that I am

“placing knowledge in a higher place than action”

Nor am I defending the position, as you describe it, of knowing

“all the right theology, but don’t choose to serve others”

I agree with you, what good is that?

I also agree with your description of the carpenter example and your extrapolation of that to your guitar playing. We certainly do learn while we are “doing.” I elaborated on this in response to some of the comments on my post, perhaps you might check that out.

The emphasis of my point that some seem to have missed is that I am not focusing on or defending learning knowledge at the cost of the “doing,” but for the sake of the “doing,” and also for the proper “doing.” I also believe that God can use our mistakes in that process for His good, as in the case of Joseph’s brothers.

Maybe my point would be better stated that Biblical “doing” requires Biblical “knowledge,” and that comes from the Bible. Of course, we should start “doing” as soon as we become Christians, and we should always be learning through that process.

My point was that the guide through this process is Scripture, and not man. A Biblically led man can lead another man, Biblically. A man leading from the authority of his own ideas only leads another man astray.

The Bible as the authority is the issue, and that requires Bible knowledge. This point does not in any way diminish our necessity for “doing” insofar as frequency or quantity is concerned.

I would never argue that talking the talk takes precedent over walking the walk.

Thanks for the fair review of my post,
Tony Rose

4   Phil Miller    http://veritasfellowship.blogspot.com
December 7th, 2007 at 3:46 pm

Tony,
Thanks for the friendly comment.

I figured in the end, are views weren’t really that far off. I just sort of took your post as a starting point.

I think there’s a danger in any field for people to become educated beyond the point of usefulness. I live in college town, and I see it all the time. I’m definitely not against education, or learning as much as one can. But if in the end it doesn’t help us to love our neighbor anymore, it becomes just esoteric.

God bless

5   robbymac    http://www.robbymac.org
December 7th, 2007 at 5:08 pm

I’ve always been fascinated by how many times the word “faith” in the New Testament is used in reference to an action of some sort. To equate “faith” with “knowledge” is ridiculous; at the same time, I have a couple of degrees in theology, and love reading, especially church history and the history of theological development over the centuries (so I’m not anti-knowledge, not by a long shot!).

But still, “faith” seems to be a word tied to action, according to the New Testament. I think St. James said it best: “Faith without works is dead.”

‘Nuff said. ;)

6   robbymac    http://www.robbymac.org
December 7th, 2007 at 5:13 pm

P.S. I play both guitar and bass. And a little keyboard, dulcimer, djembe, mandolin, and occasionally attempts at the harmonica. Not so good at “shutting up”, however, or so my friends tell me. :)