Ah the latest dust up around Rick Warren has hit, and calling it a tempest in a tea pot would be, well, generous. What has been largely agreed on are the facts. Warren attended a conference run by Schuller 18 years ago and was deeply impacted by Schuller’s ability to appeal to non-believers. Here’s the quote from Christianity Today:
“During his last year in seminary, he and Kay drove west to visit Robert Schuller’s Institute for Church Growth. “We had a very stony ride out to the conference,†she says, because such nontraditional ministry scared her to death. Schuller, though, won them over. “He had a profound influence on Rick,†Kay says. “We were captivated by his positive appeal to nonbelievers. I never looked back.â€
Imitating Schuller, Warren walked the (then unincorporated but fast-growing) town of Lake Forest, asking what kept people from going to church. (Online Source).â€
In the recent interview cited by watchdoggies everywhere to keep their base up in arms and coming back to their websites Warren stated:
“I’ve only met Robert Schuller twice, I believe. I’ve never had a one-on-one conversation with him. Not once. So how do I even know him?”
These facts are not in dispute, no one has offered any evidence or even wild accusation that Warren has had more contact with Schuller than what has been stated above. The only thing that is being argued about is how best to describe their relationship of two meetings and a conference 18 years ago.
So who does Ken Silva go to to sort out his opinion for him? Why Robert Schuller’s own organization.
So maybe after we get done discussing how to describe Warren’s relationship with Schuller, we can start the discussion on how Silva’s own relationship with Schuller can best be described. Is Silva being mentored by Schuller’s website (after all that’s a lot more interactive than tapes)?
15 Comments(+Add)
The same way that I go to Velvet Elvis to find out what Rob Bell believes (or doesn’t believe)…
Clearly,
You don’t see anything, well, clearly.
What is being argued about is how to assess this relationship. Not the facts behind the assessments, not the beliefs of either Schuller or Warren, this is essentially an argument about analysis. And who did Ken go to for his analysis? Robert Schuller.
Shuller believes that he mentored Warren. Warren’s wife believes his influence to be strong. Ken cited Shuller. What’s the problem here?
If you’re into Robert Schuller there’s no problem. If, on the other hand, you find his judgment suspect then there is a problem. Ken Silva apparently doesn’t find his judgment suspect.
Also, you not seeing a problem isn’t surprising. Silva could eat a baby alive and you’d have some sort of reason why that’s actually ok.
It’s actually Hillary who eats babies alive (almost) and Warren has her on his stage!
clearly,
Schuller believes he is mentoring everyone… LOL!
It is called positive thinking… not always reality based thinking.
But the accusation was about “church planting” and Schuller was an innovator of his day… so i am not even sure how this is of any cause for alarm at all… I mean I know a lot of “fundamentalist” churches that run like a business and we know all commerce is of the whore of Babylon… so I guess then the whore of Babylon mentors these fundy churches? Come, you got to admit that makes more sense and is just as absurd! LOL!
Oh and btw aren’t the Clinton’s SBC? So should we connect them as mentoring the SBC!!!!!
Oh and I have read a couple of Schuller’s books.. I am sure that qualifies me as been mentored… as I have gone to the Crystal Cathedral (it has a beautiful wooden pulpit so it is Ingrid apporved!) at least mentored as much as Ken Silva was by listening to a few Walter Martin tapes… (that seemed to do him no good at all!)
This is truly a joke and show nothing more than the insanity of those who hate their brothers and sisters in Christ…
iggy
Well, I guess Schuller’s claim of mentoring Rick Warren is probably more valid than Ken’s claim of “serving under” Walter Martin, since Warren and Schuller have at least met and they were both alive at the time.
This is almost as convincing as Ken’s case for Warren being responsible for Rupert Murdoch.
I think Ken is responsible for Murdoch as if God placed him on his heart, Ken should have gone to Murdoch brother to brother and lovingly confronted him instead of attacking him in public… LOL! I mean Ken is so important he was mentioned in Christianity Today!
iggy
If a pastor says he is one of the sheep in my church, and the man claims that the pastor is “my pastor” Doesn’t the pastor have obligation to watch his soul. Because pastors will have to give an account to God for everyone they taught, trained, discipled, ect…
So if Warren is the pastor of Murdoch. The reposiblity is up to Warren to grow Murdoch in the faith that was once and for all delieverd to the saints.
Kyle,
Not that dead horses don’t get beaten here, but the whole Murdoch thing has been discussed to death. Please check some of these threads out for the discussion to date…
Chris
Warren is a good guy who severely compromises for moral and humanitarian causes. He is neither the anti-christ or John the Baptists. I have no idea how Scheuller impacted him, but he has systematized the gospel in deference to elicit positive responses and not just a clear presentation of the gospel without regard to what the Holy Spirit does in a person’s heart.
The internet: beating dead horses since 1994.
lol
Phil,
I’ve updated the glossary to include “Studied at the feet of…”