I urge you to stop the bickering and angry rhetoric. Those who want to believe what they want to believe — regardless of the facts — will do go their own way despite the truth. It will NOT matter to them what is said, or how clearly and patiently it is said. I explained this whole silly Robert Schuller thing with regard to Rick Warren (including Kay’s oft-abused quote) in my 2005 book “Rick Warren and the purpose that Drives Him” (see pp. 99-106). It has made no difference. People like Silva and others WANT to believe Warren is a heretic. Indeed, they MUST continue to believe it in order to justify themselevs and push their own agenda. I pray for them. I urge you to pray for them also. My support for Warren has created all manner of false rumors to be spread about me, my faith, my ministry, and devotion to God. It has been a terrifically painful thing to watch. The days are indeed evil — but not for the reasons so often cited.

peace,

R. Abanes

I’m just interested in letting my yeas be yeas and my nays be nays. I get tired of the constant spin in our society, be it from the pundits, the politicians, or the preachers.

And oh by the way, I am a fan of of PDC and think PDL is a great way to get introduced to Christian orthopraxy.

I am also interested in yes being yes and no being no… And truth being truth and a lie being a lie… and I am very tired of Ken and company not knowing the difference.

As far as PDL, I was very involved in a couple of PDL churches… I see some good things from it but as far a for me, I am not a RW fan… I have not even finished the 40 days of purpose as I just found it a bit… boring.

I am not against PDL I am just not fan of it…

I think this site understands yes being yes and no being no and at times go to absurdity to show how silly Ken and company are at times…

There is more “proof” that Al Gore is a clone and the real AL Gore is captive under the Whitehouse… just look at the way the man’s politics changed since the early 80’s… yet is that true?

That is often how I read Ken… he takes something that is not really that big… puffs it out of proportion then attacks it.

On some occasions, he is right… I have even stated that a few times… yet the stuff he writes on the most with all the name-calling seems to blur the yes and the no and makes it a mixture.

Ken is SBC and calls it apostate… so he is in no position of integrity to go after anyone. If he truly were so honest and true, he would hand in his ordination. Yet, that does not even get to the points where he has only gone out with slander and lies and disregarded the truth.

iggy

I’m just interested in letting my yeas be yeas and my nays be nays

And how do you know Warren isn’t.

And oh by the way, I am a fan of of PDC and think PDL is a great way to get introduced to Christian orthopraxy.

Oh… wrong forum… but it seemed more interesting than arguing over something 18 years ago that was either profound or heavily or whatever in how RW approached his CHURCH PLANT… it does not say he was influenced in his views on Schuller’s teachings…

I guess also following this logic, Ken was a “rock star” with a record out… many years ago, so he is still profoundly influenced by his once decadent lifestyle… (I mean he had long hair and stuff!)

Ken was heavily influenced by the acetone in the Walter Martin tapes he listened to and decided to do the opposite of!
Ken was heavily influenced by the Clintons as they are now the mentors of the SBC… I guess he has truly learned a lot from them as they got away with a bunch of lies…

I mean this from a guy who can’t even decide if he is a Calvinist or not, but will lambaste anyone who is not!

Ken, the man, the lies the hater false accuser of Christian brethren.

iggy

And I am not even a fan of PDL at all.

Personally, I don’t see why he even bothered to address this. It was 18 years ago. A man can’t change?
I wouldn’t matter to me if he was a Mormon 18 years ago, it’s only an issue to his detractors.

I just wish Rick had fessed up to Schuller having had a profound effect on his ministry 18 years ago instead of trying to dodge the bullet by referencing the fact that he has never had a “one on one” conversation with the man. That’s the kind of spin doctoring that gets us all into trouble.

In the words of one famous spin doctor, it always depends on what the meaning of the word “is” is . . .

I guess I’m in trouble too Dave. Robert Schuller had a profound in infuence on me too. He had a hand in bringing me to Christ. I’ll try to make this testimony as short as possible…..first off GEEZER alert, cause I’m going to go WAY back!

After coming out of the military I was drawn into the sales field. In 1971 I was reading Og Mandino, Dale Carnegie, Norman Vincent Peele. They were the “scripture” writers of their day for many in sales. It was the “gospel” to many in the sales field I was in. On a boring Sunday I was channel surfing(ALL four of them) and tripped across Robert Schuller, back before his hair had turned white! I certainly was an unbeliever at that time and certainly wasn’t looking for God in any shape form or manner. But, Schuller lured me in. I watch him for few years, read some of his books and was hooked! He was saying everything I had studied. If I had been living in California I would had been at his institute. I lived in Michigan so I only had his books so in a way, I DID attend.

It was Schuller that lowered my defenses. To the the point that I was able to cross the threshold of a little Bible thumpin’ church in New York. Before Schuller that would not have happen. I thought a church was a church was a church. I accepted Christ in that little church in 1974, did I still listen to Schuller? Yup,but, as I matured in Christ I out grew Schuller’s message. Albeit it was only eighteen years ago that Rick Warren for me it’s been almost 35 years. Would I be viewed in that same light when I say the Robert Schuller had a profound effect on me? Do I still follow and endorse what Schuller teaches? No But I guess in some peoples eyes I too would be guilty by association.

I’ll make that same statement, “He had a profound influence on ME,” Scotty says. “I was captivated by his positive appeal to nonbelievers. I never looked back.”

So what am I now, Dave? I trust God enough to know that he can use anything and anybody to bring one to the thrown of Grace. Even people and organizations that are a bit less than what standard you judge by.

Tim, I can see your pride was hurt when I took you to school on “self-proclaimed.”

And I can see that you’re blind not just to Ken’s lies, but your own.

IF it wasn’t for all the lies watchdoggies told I’d almost think you were good intentioned and misguided.