Both CRN and slice are up in arms once again over Rick Warren’s peace plan.  As expected, this global movement towards ending hunger, AIDS and poverty is getting lots of attention from many media outlets.  These ODMs cannot understand why a Christian would ever want to partner with someone of a different faith or sexuality to end such a horrendous problem in the world.  I wonder why the ODMs did not protest churches working alongside non-believers to help clean up Katrina or bring aid to the tsunami victims.  Surely, they too were advocating universalism.  Or could it be that simply because Rick Warren is behind this movement, it must be inherently heretical?

Recently CRN boiled down Warren’s message to this

Global Crisis Requires Global Spiritual Unity for Global Good

This could not be further from the truth.  Spiritual Unity implies that we all need to be unified in our faith to combat this crisis.  I challenge any ODM to find where Warren has said that we all must share the same spirituality to combat this.  Never once has he called for spiritual unity, but for people of all faiths to work together, which does not require spiritual unity.  You see, this is not a spiritual issue, this is a human issue that we are facing.  Christians, Muslims or Hindus are not dying everyday , humans are dying everyday.  The phrase should be altered to say

Global Crisis Requires Global Human Unity for Global Good

I truly believe that most ODMs have a hard time not seeing people in one of two categories:  the non-elect and the elect.  They cannot simply see people as human.  I mean, this issue should appeal to our basic human compassion.  Almost every culture in the world agrees that certain actions, such as murder, poverty and disease epidemics, are horrible atrocities.  But, this is why you will hardly ever see an article on CRN that addresses the suffering of HUMANS in Africa, or the genocide that is taking place in Darfur.  If it doesn’t have a “Christian” label and theology attached to it, it is worthless.

Now, I will say this, because I know the rebuttal is coming, our primary message is to preach the gospel.  However, a hefty portion of Jesus’ teachings were on feeding the hungry, caring for widows and praying for the sick.  It is not an either/or situation;  It is a both/and.  I challenge the ODMS today.  Are you against Warren’s peace plan because he is truly calling for a “Global Spiritual Unity”, or are you against it because it is simply Rick Warren?

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This entry was posted on Wednesday, January 30th, 2008 at 12:27 pm and is filed under Christian Living, Editor, Ingrid, Ken Silva, Linked Articles, ODM Responses, ODM Writers, PD/SS, Updates. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
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27 Comments(+Add)

1   Kevin I    
January 30th, 2008 at 1:20 pm

It always bothers me when these things get slammed. Why not celebrate that for once, a work of concern of the church also happens to be something others are interested in doing as well, why sweat someone from drumming up all the manpower one can for meeting a need or adressing a problem?

2   Matt B
January 30th, 2008 at 1:26 pm

It doesn’t matter what Warren does, it matters that he doesn’t line up 100% with the ODM doctrines.

3   Tim Reed, Owosso MI
January 30th, 2008 at 1:39 pm

It doesn’t matter what Warren does, it matters that he doesn’t line up 100% with the ODM doctrines.

Its less about doctrine and more about style.

4   I. Todyaso
January 30th, 2008 at 2:14 pm

Kevin I,

It doesn’t matter what Warren does, it matters that he doesn’t line up 100% with the ODM doctrines.

Matthew 15: 9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.


What would you know about style?

I. Todyaso

5   Matt B
January 30th, 2008 at 2:50 pm

The ODMs will say style is doctrine.

6   Neil    
January 30th, 2008 at 2:57 pm

I. Todyaso,

Not sure what that means, but it sounds rather confrontaitonal…

I won’t speculate on the motivations of the ODM’s opposition, but I know the hyper-Dispensationalists I used to spare with would say that the Bible predicts things will get worse and that peace cannot be achieved, therefore we should not attempt such efforts.


7   Chris L
January 30th, 2008 at 3:12 pm

Iggy – errr – I Todyaso…

You’re weird sometimes…

8   Zan    
January 31st, 2008 at 3:36 pm

all I know is that I can’t support an organization that accepts help and endorsement from Tom Brady.

My mom lied to me when should used to tell me, “Winners never cheat and Cheaters never win.”

9   iggy
January 31st, 2008 at 4:29 pm

You’re weird sometimes…

Only sometimes? I am trying to get away from getting all angry and bent out of shape over some peoples “issues” here.

Just to warn you, I. Todyaso is my alter ego whose hero is Ken Silva.


10   Chris L
January 31st, 2008 at 4:40 pm

I love Zan :)

11   Matt B
January 31st, 2008 at 5:22 pm

Hey, no knocking the Perfect Pats!

12   Paula
February 1st, 2008 at 3:23 pm

Nothing wrong with doing nice things for people. But it is not the gospel. And the church, government, and businesses in any arrangement will not solve the five global giants. I’m waiting for Rick to suggest that maybe the answer is Christ, but so far have been disappointed. Maybe JUST maybe… that’s just what CRN’s and Slice’s problem with Warren….

13   Chris L
February 1st, 2008 at 3:27 pm

Nothing wrong with doing nice things for people. But it is not the gospel.

That’s funny, but I thought “love your neighbor” fit somewhere in there along with “make disciples”…

14   Neil    
February 1st, 2008 at 3:33 pm

Chris L.,

I’d say that comment – “…it’s not the Gospel” pretty much illustrates a modernist reductionism of the Gospel.


15   Phil Miller
February 1st, 2008 at 3:33 pm

I’ve been thinking about this. Who exhibits more faith – someone who does what God commands, but might have some questionable theology, or someone who has airtight theology but doesn’t act?

It seems to me that Warren’s critics are defining faith as just mental assent to the Gospel. This is not what the Bible defines faith as though. Faith always involves an action on our part. I don’t think mental assent actually has to be even the first step. I think God honors people taking steps in the right direction even if they don’t understand what they’re doing sometimes.

16   Neil    
February 1st, 2008 at 3:35 pm


Usually, when a team is caught violating the rules (i.e. – cheating) they must forfeit at least that game. Therefore, as far as I’m concerned, their season is not perfect.

No doubt they are one of the greatest of all time – but not perfect.


17   Neil    
February 1st, 2008 at 3:38 pm


I think it is a reduction of the Gospel to what you call mental assent. It started with making conversion synonymous with walking a “saw-dust trail” and later coming forward for an altar call. It’s perpetuated in the zeal to get someone to repeat a particular prayer.


18   Matt B
February 1st, 2008 at 3:40 pm

I can’t believe we’ve hijacked the thread this much. :)

No team could have taken the tape and analyzed the defense signals by the next half. It’s an impossibility. Not only that, but if you see stills of the Jet’s sideline, they had at least 4 guys giving defense signals, 3 of those being decoys. You would have to figure out which guy was the “correct” guy.

They got caught. They didn’t use it for that game. It didn’t effect the game.

19   I. Todyaso
February 1st, 2008 at 5:19 pm

This should clear up all the garbage of misinfo that is out there. My superior Pastor/Teacher discernment helped me see what Chris R was afraid to say.

In fact my article is more of a gift to all than his was.

I. Todyaso

20   amy    
February 1st, 2008 at 6:10 pm

I. Todyaso,
I assume that since you are trying to imitate a certain person you can now receive remarks in the same spirit as many remarks addressed to said person?

For example, I am free to say, “I assume you also spend all day at the computer and don’t do any real ministry for Christ?”

And I suppose any thread on which you write can be hijacked with personal comments directed to you, no matter how you say what you say and no matter what the topic?

Fair enough?

21   I. Todyaso    
February 1st, 2008 at 7:03 pm


Why are you wanting to attack this servant of God who is a gift to all on the Internet as their pastor!

“I assume you also spend all day at the computer and don’t do any real ministry for Christ?”

Since I have such a greater calling on my life than you have on yours I will say, YES! I spend all day at the computer so I do have to do any REAL ministry. I can devote my time to God and HIS MINISTRY of death and condemnation that comes from His Wrath and anger for sinners.

Are even saved? I mean you come here and hang out with this heretics so how can you even be saved?

I like to just come here and make comments that stir things up and leave. I am not going to come back unless God brings me back to stir these sick perverts up more.

BTW the only Global movement Rick Warren is ever going to do is the bowel movements as he flys over the Nations he is drawing into his evil Purpose Driven world!

I am here to let all know God has not plan or purpose for anyone once the get saved! We all just go to Heaven.

I hope that helps you understand how much greater my gift of pastor/teacher is, after all you are a woman. We make no exceptions except for Ingrid as she is such a Puritan.

I. Todyaso

22   amy    
February 1st, 2008 at 8:51 pm

Maybe I was wrong about who I thought you were impersonating. You don’t sound like him.

Forgive me for enabling you to carry on in your “game.” It is truly no game that you are involved in, and I pity you.

23   Matt B
February 1st, 2008 at 9:59 pm


Just calm down. It’s not like Iggy insulted God. And I think the person Iggy might be impersonating even thinks it’s funny.

It seems that ODM also means Obstructed Discernment of Mirth.

24   Neil    
February 1st, 2008 at 10:26 pm

They got caught. They didn’t use it for that game. It didn’t effect the game. – Matt

Yeah – I know what ya mean by hijacked… :)

So, “they got caught” – implies they did something against the rules

And, “it didn’t effect the game” – implies breaking the rules is OK if it doesn’t work…


25   Neil    
February 1st, 2008 at 10:29 pm

I. Todyaso (AKA Iggy)

Please refrain from needless sarcasm and posts that seem to serve only to escalate the rhetoric.


26   Neil    
February 1st, 2008 at 11:33 pm

Matt B.

Had I seen Zan’s post I would have left it at that…


27   amy    
February 2nd, 2008 at 2:02 pm


Just calm down. It’s not like Iggy insulted God. And I think the person Iggy might be impersonating even thinks it’s funny.

I assure you I’m quite calm. And it matters not to me whether or not the person being impersonated thinks it’s funny.

God does hold us responsible for our words and attitudes. I’ve spent a year at least reading, skimming, or purposefully skipping Iggy’s comments. I can’t see the humour without seeing the other attitudes that I see under his comments. If Iggy is God’s child, surely God has something better for Iggy to do in life . . . .

By the way, I regret ever suggesting to you that you write an article here, which I did because I wanted to get you to actually think of the reasons behind why you were saying things. I regret it for your own sake.