In honor of Oprah taking the google hits from Rob Bell at CRN. Honest, this was today’s “Get Fuzzy.”
But seriously, why Oprah? Isn’t Star Wars or Shirley MacLain just as dangerous? Oh yeah, it’s about the google hits.
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41 Comments(+Add)
I think because Oprah is one of the most influential celebrities in America right now and she’s promoting a seductive, and false, spirituality. I mean, has anyone even heard from Shirley MacLaine in the last five or ten years?
I actually like the Oprah Church, she doesn’t need a salary and there’s a prize under every pew!
Here’s even a better church:
“Visitors Welcome!”
RayJr-
That was my point. I remember back in the late 80s, some Christians were running around like Chicken Little, all worried about Shirley MacLaine and how she was going to bring in the new world order. Guess what? It never happened.
I suppose there are some people that are influenced by Oprah, but do we always need to cater the dumbest of the population? I know, I know, weaker brother and all that…
This week for my sermon, congregation, I will be talking about why you shouldn’t listen to Oprah. Next week we’ll talk about why you shouldn’t stare directly into the sun…
“Guess what? It never happened.”
Maybe.
“Next week we’ll talk about why you shouldn’t stare directly into the sun…”
That’s funny! But after speaking with people personally, I have come to accept my estimation of many people’s spiritual sophistication as vastly overestimated. Hence the need for shepherds who both feed and protect.
Oprah’s influence and others like her will be felt in years to come simply by the sheer weight of her personality, monetary resources, and demonic power even when to us it seems ridiculous.
Excuse me while I step outside to look at the sun!!
Shirley MacLaine wrote several books promoting her new age philosophy. Her books were somewhat (very?) popular due to MacLaine’s celebrity and I think Christians were right to be concerned about her influence, whether it was of “new world order” proportions or not.
Same thing with Oprah today. In fact, I would argue that, thanks to television, Oprah’s influence far surpasses that of Shirley MacLaine’s.
I may not agree with their style, but if the ODMs are raising concerns about Oprah’s promotion of similar new age spirituality, then I’m with them. How does the saying go: Even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometimes.
I would say Tom Cruise’s shilling for Scientology and Madonna’s devotion to Kabalah would be just as influential if either of those beliefs weren’t so darn goofy. The way Oprah couches her beliefs in such palatable, even Christian-sounding terms makes her more of a threat. Tickling ears and all that.
Ray Jr-
MacLaine was very popular. She even had at least one TV movie about her New Age experience.
There is a place for discernment. I go to the only megachurch in Massachussets and even our pastor called out Oprah this past Sunday as someone who is teaching some bad stuff. We don’t need a whole web site ad nauseamly google jacking the internet against Oprah.
It is incumbent upon believers to understand the “spirit of the age” and the Cult behind the Culture if we are to effectively engage in warfare (spiritual, of course).
Oprah should be pointed out. She should be challenged.
Oprah is waving the banner high for the teachings of the False Christ. Hosting daily sessions with Williamson and Tolle, she has a global outreach to anyone on earth with internet.
To glibly state “it never happened” in response to those who raised the alarm about MaClaine years ago – is rather naive.
It IS happening. Now.
In the same way, I recall almost 20 years ago when J.Z. Knight came on the scene. J.Z. channels a 35,000 year old spirit named Ramtha. We could make note of it, dismiss her, and simply get back to “loving people into the kingdom.” However, a movie was released a few years ago by some disciples of Ramtha, in which they use Quantum Physics to promote their spiritual ideas. This movie has influenced many people and spawned “Prophecy Conferences” all over the country, with highly regarded leaders and teachers in attendance.
Our witness will not always be perceived as Loving. In the eyes of a generation which knows nothing higher than Self, raised on a false, skewed form of Tolerance, the Gospel and its demands may very well sound like Hate.
“How dare you say I am a lost sinner!”
If you have not read it, I highly recommend Warren Smith’s book – “Reinventing Jesus Christ.” It’s available to print online.
oh i do adore Get Fuzzy…
i have. she’s telepathically cleaning out my car right now.
also, sometimes they get hit by cars.
i think part of why all the hullabaloo over Oprah sounds so ridiculous is because it’s got this Chicken Little tone to it, and as soon as Oprah’s little online thing is over, it’ll be someone else, and then it will be someone else after that…it sounds like a broken record.
call me when Tyra declares herself the anti-Christ.
Evan – I am much more worried about that Stedman. He is very dangerous behind the scenes!
what with his “business trips” and all.
Gayle is also most likely a demon in disguise, and John Travolta flies them all around on a space-plane so they can spread their demonic ways to the whole world.
don’t even get me started on Josh Groban. Oprah looooooves Josh Groban, so he’s obviously hiding his horns and blinding us with that beautiful voice.
Gayle is also most likely a demon in disguise, and John Travolta flies them all around on a space-plane so they can spread their demonic ways to the whole world.
don’t even get me started on Josh Groban. Oprah looooooves Josh Groban, so he’s obviously hiding his horns and blinding us with that beautiful voice.
Sounds like an awesome GURPS campaign.
The problem with many on this site (incl this point) is that you are so anti-discernment that you automatically dismiss anything that is questionable just because of who raised the issue. A very silly strategy in my view.
If New Age has ever had a foothold in society – and even in the church – it is now. These types of shifts/evolutions don’t happen overnight, so let’s not be naive.
Oprah has major influence on millions of people.
The argument I see here is like the dumb argument that says, “I can watch whatever I want on TV – it doesn’t affect me at all because I know how to separate truth and reality.” Really? I guess that’s why companies spend billions of dollars/yr on advertising/branding – because it doesn’t work.
We aren’t “anti-discernment”. We are anti-hysteria, anti-fearmongering, and anti-all-the-other-bad-methodology the so-called “discernment ministries” employ in their “truth war” (which is an ironic term if there ever was one, because it seems like it’s perfectly acceptable to lie about your opponent if you’re fighting in a truth war).
The thing is these people actually hurt the cause of real discernment by adding incomprehensible noise to conversation.
Are we any more or less New Age when Star Wars came out? Or when the song “Age of Aquarius” came out? Or when Shirley MacLaine wrote her books and did her movie? Can you provide evidence?
Can you provide evidence that fundamentalist Christianity has affected the popularity or the cultural influence of Star Wars? That’s like saying the Amish have effected car sales in Lancaster, PA.
Evidence (for Matt’s sake)… there have never been more books, movies, discussions in public forums, websites/blogs, noise and chatter about New Age than now. Simple.
Also, it has actually become somewhat mainstream as it has filtered into Christianity more than ever before. In fact, their form of “Jesus” is one of their most popular characters nowadays.
Phil said: “We aren’t “anti-discernment”. ”
You can also be so laissez-faire that you swallow everything whole.
I could be wrong but I think the Holy Spirit has more spiritual pull than Oprah.
Prayer before Protest should always be our model.
You could also be so hyper-vigilant that you never let anything in.
“But the Lord was not in the fire or the storm or the earthquake…”
Paul-
Perhaps I should say convincing evidence. I don’t see any more evidence now then in the past. Could you provide some evidence, other then your word?
From my point of view, Frank Peritti’s “This Present Darkness” series pointed out (and exaggerated) the influence of New Age philosophy. It isn’t any more now then it was then.
New Age sections of book stores aren’t any bigger then they were in the late 80s.
If you say so Matt, if you say so.
BTW, how old were you in the late 80s when you were perusing these bookstores?
How do you measure something like “influence” anyway? It seems like such a nebulous concept. How many people that watch Oprah and even buy books from her book club actually take it seriously? Or is just a thing to do? How would someone begin to know?
I could say that Michael Jackson was one of the most influential entertainers of the 25 years, and I’d be correct. Of course not everyone who was influenced by him turned out to be a child molester. So in the same way, saying that Oprah is influential can mean different things.
I didn’t see anyone lining up for a Michael Jackson endorsement during the primaries. For what it’s worth, despite Michael Jordan being the most highly recognized athlete on the planet, nor was anyone knocking on his door.
On the other hand, you have others that wield tremendous media clout, have a loud voice, a wide audience and tangibly influence people. She’s got television, the internet, books, a magazine. Though impossible to measure in quantitative certains (hence the absurdity of Matt’s request for “proof”), it would be foolhardy to deny the strength of these influencers.
Consider one thing though…
Step 1: publishers will kill to get recommended on her show. Step 2: They get recommended.
Step 3: Books become instant bestsellers.
See the connection?
Paul C-
Junior High and High School. It was Waldenbooks or Paperback Booksmith back then (Borders and Barnes and Noble weren’t around). I wasn’t perusing New Age bookstores. Just generic, everyday bookstores.
I’m not saying she doesn’t have any influence. Of course she does in some sense, or she wouldn’t have her show. I’m just saying that she’s probably not worth having some sort of huge “counter-offensive” over.
Based on sheer audience numbers, I would think that Rush Limbaugh is a lot more influential than her. Oddly enough, a lot of Christians don’t seem to have a problem with him.
Also, books are really on the low-end of the media totem pole any more. For a book to be a bestseller, it has to sell very little compared to other media products. If a book sells 50,000 copies, it’s considered a big success. If a CD or DVD does that, it’s a failure. It’s all relative.
A few years ago, Napolean Dynomite was the biggest movie of the year. People were wearing “Vote for Pedro” t shirts and quoting the movie ad nauseam.
It was written and directed by Jared Hess and Jerusha Hess, both devote Mormons. The star of the film, Jon Heder, is also a Mormon.
Millions became Mormons as a result of the film. I saw the film and converted myself. Errr…actually, I made that last bit up.
James Dobson????? Oh…nevermind!
eggggg-zactly.
at least “i saw it this on Oprah” isn’t a HUNDRED percent guaranteed to be complete garbage.
Yea but Matt – how many who coverted to Mormonism left later when they saw the South Park clip?
Dum-dum-dum-dum-dum
There was this one guy named Jim Jones and he was teaching some crazy things and millions of people started following him and they all ended up killing themselves…. oh wait? What’s that? It wasn’t millions of people? Oh I guess it doesn’t matter what he was teaching then since only a handful of people actually were “dumb” enough to follow his teaching.
Excuse me while I go look directly at the sun.
Rick…arrrgg…must…stop…too..funny…
I used to be naughty (personal conviction folks!) and watch that show and that episode was just sooooo funny.
um, South Park is one of the most brilliant shows on TV.
of course it’s naughty, but it’s also amazingly relevant.
they totally had the last word on the Schiavo controversy.
call me when Oprah starts eating people or giving them Kool-Aid or whatever.
haha, that would be the funniest “Favorite Things” episode ever.
“this is my favorite punch, and YOU’RE ALL GETTING SOME!!!!!” in that sing-songy voice she does.
haha. audience all dead.
That explains its cult status.
Biggest movie of the year (2004)? It grossed $44M, which isn’t a bad return on a $400K budget. But there were 69 higher grossing movies that year.
And perhaps I run in the wrong circles, but I never saw a single “Vote For Pedro” t-shirt or heard a single quote from the movie (still can’t name one).
you might not have realized you heard quotes from the movie, but they were there.
and i got so tired of seeing those stupid t-shirts…they were evvvvvverywhere.
i never saw the movie.
That’s a good point, never having seen the movie, people could have been dropping quotes and I would have been none the wiser.
Now “Caddyshack” and “Airplane”, on the other hand…well, now I’m dating myself.
So what does that prove? There will always these fringe groups that spring up, just like the group that was raided down in Texas recently. I don’t think there’s one person or group of people appointed to continually police all these different groups. At some point, people are responsible for their own actions.
Part of the problem I see is that we still look to pastors as a sort of spiritual emperor or something. We want them to tell us what to do, and we want them to give us these pronouncements on what’s good and what’s bad. The only problem is that’s not what a pastor’s role is.
A pastor is compared to shepherd, and yes a shepherd watches over his sheep, but he also knows them all individually. What most “discernment ministries” are doing is simply making pronouncements and judgements from their internet towers to the huddled masses below. I think discernment in its New Testament mandated form is supposed to take place in the context of a local congregation, and it’s not just a pastor telling everyone what they should think about something. It’s every Christian looking out for the others like a family.
Actually, if you look at people who get caught up in cults, you’ll see that there are actually a lot of them who are coming from really bad church experiences. So they have a group of people telling them, “come with us, we’ll treat you like family”, and they go. So I see cults and such as a symptom of the failure of local churches to live out their callings in their communities more than as product of a lack a “watchman”.
I for one never know what any tee shirt means, especially the movie ones. I guess I’m like the old man who still gets amazed at the automatic doors at the grocery store.
“Wow, look at that! What will they think of next!!”
Phil – good points. The ultimate disconnect for me is when these ministries are Calvinistic. I mean, duh? How do you spend your time warning people who cannot be warned and others who cannot be deceived? And you can’t say “Jim Jones led people to hell” because they were SUPPOSED to go to hell!?!?
I will never understand what these reformed watchmen are watching for, God’s will? They should post things like this:
Rick Warren waters down the gospel and we rejoice!
Brian MacLaren is a heretic and we thank him for being in the center of God’s will!
Millions are still decieved proving God’s faithfulness!
Rob Bell’s deceptive teachings exalt Christ – Thanks Rob!
Aren’t those titles more logical in light of their theologies?