Believe me I understand about relatives in cults. I have a mother-in-law who is a minister in Unity, cousins who run the Unitarian Church and so on. Yet, if I blast them with truth they will not respond. I found as I talk to them and note that they misquote a scripture, I might expound on it a little and let the truth of it seek it’s course. I have seen others be freed by the Truth… I rarely have seen a cultist argued into the Kingdom… in fact I can’t recall a single time I have seen that work.

I have been blacklisted in every town I lived in by the JW’s for letting them in and asking them questions they cannot answer. I have asked Mormons about their own doctrines which most I have talked to never even knew their church taught. I have shared with Buddhists that their way is much like the Mosaic Law and that no man can become perfect without divine help… I have conversed with Daoist who see Jesus as the Tao and slowly begin to realize that they can have a personal relationship with this Tao in the Person of Jesus…

All of these are baby steps and take time. There is no drop a tract an run… I invest in the person and love them and show the contrast respectfully. I do not always see the fruit, but sometimes I do and it is glorious! I take none of the Glory as I may plant or water, but God makes it grow.

blessings
iggy

I understand what you’re saying. Don’t pull up the weeds for the sake of the wheat. That I can deal with because that’s the reality we deal with right now. But it would be better if did what we could to keep the weeds from establishing a foothold and becoming so…weedy. After all, what farmer plants wheat in a field of weeds?

You have to understand I have a number of relatives in cults, so now you might have a better understanding of my (possible overstatement) combativeness on this topic.

I prefer peculiar… it is more biblical… LOL!

I think you misunderstood me. I didn’t mean to criticise Todd in a condensending way. I find what he is doing strange, very strange. If God chooses to work in spite of the strangeness… well He is God. Gifting or God working through any of us is all grace and says nothing about our caracter or how right our doctrines are. Some put their doctrine so high and claim perfection of it and still God works in spite of that. Others creates a circus act and still God works in spite of that.

I grew up in a penticostal church (my dad was a pastor there) and later were a worship leader in a very charismatic church (during the Toronto thing) so I saw and heard pretty weird stuff in my life. Currenty I am serving in a seeker sensitive type church. In all of these I saw God change people’s lives, not only bringing them to salvation but healing them from many hurts. This made me sure of this thing: God uses us broken, screwed up and erronous as we are and does His perfect work through us. How? I don’t know but He does. Why? So that only He can get the glory.

Within that church which had many issues, there were strong believers. One was a professor at the local university who lived on 10% of his income and gave 90%away. He invested a good year in me in teaching. I did not agree with all he taught even then…yet he was one of the best examples in my life… So within that “bad” was some good… and in that good God reached in in spite of the human error.

iggy

These things come and they go. Most often they last for a few months.

Exactly. It’s fast, hot and soon burned out.

Here is where I am on the grace issue: I would never say your wife’s conversion/salvation is invalid because it happened in that kind of chuch. I leave that to God. Having said that, I would think she would have left that heavy on emotion/light on substance type of church behind as she became more mature. But a lot of people don’t and we need to be aware of that reality as well.

Mostly I think we agree… yet I think it is in the degree of grace we give the other we disagree with. If I was the little old lady who Todd kicked in the head… I might not think that was cool.

These things come and they go. Most often they last for a few months.

Rarely have I seen an actual revival. Most the time it is a charlatans that comes to town and gives emotional appeals and people give him lots of money… and cry and yet… sometimes people like my wife get saved out of it. Remember it is not the person… it is God who saves us.

iggy

I truly appreciate what you’re saying. I’m not saying any of us have our theology 100% correct. At the same time, I don’t believe that means (and I don’t believe this is what you are saying) that all expressions of Christian faith beyond the Gospel preached by the Apostles are equally valid.

Jim Jones was orthodox at one time. Didn’t stop him from leading more than 900 of his followers to their deaths. Even though some were forced to drink the kool-aid, they paid the price for following a false prophet.

The Way was given and presented in such a way that a child can latch onto it. We tend to forget that. And we also know that when people fail to love the truth, they will believe a lie. And all too often we have people in church leadership positions too afraid to grow a pair and call things for what they are.

When people choose (or by being either deceived or misled) to follow false teaching, they often refuse to get back into the Word and flush out the tainted meat they’ve been fed. They usually shut the Bible and focus only on the words of their leader. They ignore those checks in their spirits, the counsel of the Holy Spirit, admonitions from other believers, etc. You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink.

I got a meeting coming up after lunch. Have a great day!