Friends,
One of the things that has always impressed me about CRN.info, is the willingness to allow any and all comments to appear in threads. When I first discovered this blog, it was like a breath of fresh air that the writers here do nothing to stifle conversation, nothing to prevent disagreement, nothing to censor those with whom they have differences. I have always appreciated that because more often than not what I have found is an opportunity for grace to flow freely and to be administered abundantly. Coming here and finding this kind of free flow of ideas and thoughts and grace was like walking into a flowered field after traipsing through a cow pasture.
The recent conversations here have been even more occasions for grace to abound. I have enjoyed many of the thoughts people shared with me concerning our family’s recent graduation. I was also very impressed with many commentors who took time here to wish Jim B prayers and thoughts as he goes through a very difficult season in his own life. I was also very encouraged when Chris L posted a lengthy essay concerning Roman processions and Mark’s Gospel. The comment thread was filled with effusive praise for Chris’ hard work and research. It was also very nice to pray for Mr & Mrs Schlueter while they were on vacation recently. I can honestly say, though, I really appreciate the conversations that take place in these threads even when we do not happen to agree with one another.
By way of contrast, however, many blogs that are critical of blogs such as CRN.info do not have comment sections. They prefer, instead, to write up their opinions and not interact with anyone who may have a differing opinion. I think this is sad because in a way it is like saying, “I have the only opinion that matters and I am unwilling to even consider that someone else may have feelings or thoughts invested in this.” (This is exactly why I accepted the invitation to blog here: Nowhere else on the internet does grace flow so freely. I am treated better by some atheist’s whose blogs I visit than I am by some of the drive by ODM’s who visit here.) So I got to thinking, after spending some time reading the posts of some other bloggers where comments do not appear, what the conversation might look like if comments were allowed to appear. I have paraphrased what such a conversation might look like and what sort of devilry it might contain.
Sven
Wow. That was amazing. I have never read such a compelling damnation of Wick Rarren’s apostate heretical teaching in all my life. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I have blogged about it and I am feeling rather persecuted because I wrote about it. I request that my bio be posted on page 483 of Boxes Mook of Fartyrs because I suffer for my blog. (PS–if you’d like to help me, please make a contribution to my tax deductible tip jar.) My ministry is so important, but I will rise up and overcome. So many benefit from my work.
Jansenboy
Wow. That was amazing. Imagine how nice life would be in the church if everyone just thought like we did! Imagine how wonderful the church would be if we were the only Christians! Oh wait! We are the only Christians!!!!! On the other hand, since we are the only Christians….well, nevermind. I am the best witness on the planet! Yea! Watch me witness! Yea! What me condemn others who disagree with me!
Inga
When I was 18, I went on a field trip to a local zoo. There I was terrified to learn that there is actually more than one species of bird. All my life I had grown up my family farm thinking the only bird that existed was the chicken. I know one thing, those other birds are not birds at all. They are imposters, fakes, frauds, phonies. They only have faux feathers. They are not birds at all!
Wiggy
Don’t you all think you are being a little hard on these other folks? Isn’t there any room for grace in your church? Didn’t Jesus die for us all? I mean, I have never read anywhere that Wick Rarren denied that Jesus was Lord or that communion didn’t matter or that the Bible was errant.
Jansenboy
Jesus only died for the elect and all the rest are going to eternal hell in an eternal hand basket. I witness better than anyone. Wanna fight? Doesn’t matter. The other day, I watched a church get wrecked because they had a motorcycle in the building. I’m sure that it is absolute heresy to have motor-bikes in the Sanctuary. Lalvin said so. So did Sputher. So did Curgeon. So did Peter. Paul. Inga said so. Sven wrote it! And Waul Pasher preached on it when he was witnessing to Gypsies. If Waul Pasher said it and cried while he preached it, then that’s enough for me!
Yrrej
Well. I am sorry you feel this way. I thought there was room in God’s grace for many people–those people God is fond of. I thought Jesus died for us all. I thought he died for the sins of the whole world. (1 John 2) Your friend, yrrej.
Sven
We are not friends and don’t you ever insinuate that we are again. In fact, your presence at this blog’s comment section is absolute proof that God’s grace is narrow.
Rick
What are friends anyway? 
I have written several posts about this myself. Send me an email and I will send you the full catalog of links.
Alittlelevity
Wick Rarren is the worst kind of theologian there is and his defenders are even worse. The only thing that matters in this life is getting rid of Wick Rarren because no gospel is better than what he is preaching and teaching.
Brede P
Jansenboy is right. You free-wheeling, purpose-driven, Maclaren loving, rubbing-elbows with the Dala Lama, Rob Bell Hitlerians are worse than Hitler and Rob Bell combined. You don’t read your own stuff. You are what you hate. You are what you eat. You are becoming the very people you are the inverse of. You lovers of all people don’t understand the grace of God at all. God’s grace doesn’t mean everyone who has faith is saved–it means only those who have signed our manifesto are saved. And I can assure you that anyone who follows Erwin McManus is not saved!
Fritjov
God made the world in six days.
Sven
Inga, didn’t you write a post about that on your other blog, and do a program about it on your radio call-in program, and didn’t you condemn The Shank and all who read it as universalists who follow a man-made Jesus, and post a podcast at one of your blogs, and a youtube video at your youtube channel, and write about it in your monthly newsletter, and at your other blog, and your billboards, and on the side of your airplane? We need to make people aware of this. Let’s all write posts about it on the same day and post them at our own blogs. I am feeling rather persecuted right now. My esteem is low.
Editor
Blah. Blah. Blah. Blah.
Inga
When I was 19, I went on a vacation with my family. We flew to the mountains and there we met the hated Yeti who was nothing at all like the Yeti’s we met on the other private jet we rented one day to go to a convention in Siberia. It was every one else’s fault that Jesus had to die. But that doesn’t change the fact that the Yeti is not going to heaven. We know this to be true because he read, yes, Yeti’s can read, the Porpoise Driven Couch and The Shank. Don’t you remember reading it in the Bible where it says that Yeti’s who read PDC and The Shank can’t get into heaven? I called my lawyer and he confirmed that the Yeti had no business whatsoever attempting to ge into heaven. But I forbid anyone else from talking to their lawyers about the Yeti.
Elof
What about that other guy who does nothing but defend the Porpoise Driven Couch?
Inga
I won’t even post that. You are banned forever Elof! I’m putting in a special call to Peter at the pearly gates to make sure you are prevented from ever setting foot on a cloud or touching a harp. Wiggy is banned too! I will not have any of you mentioning grace at my blog! You are only allowed to send me stories and comments about the failures of the Porpoise Driven Couch and the Shank.
Burr
I agree with myself.
Erlend
I agree with Sven.
Hulda
I agree with Inga.
Inga
I agree too.
Sven
I agree.
Jensenboy
I agree.
Editor
You had better agree with me!
Well, this is how I imagine such a conversation might go. It’s not a pretty sight to see. What I have learned, however, is that those who belong to the so-called ODM (I have a new definition: ADM and it’s not the supermarket to the world) are safe with Jesus. For the rest of us, Jesus is not enough. I recall reading something one day from a friend. I’ll paraphrase it: I’d rather be anything than an legalist. If you are a Christian, and you enjoy being saved by grace, go ahead and comment here. You are welcome. If you hate grace and think you are the only one saved, well you can comment here too because unfortunately for you those who agree with you do not permit comments only private emails. Still, we will welcome you with open arms and invite you to be a part of our family of commentors.
***This is satire. Any resemblance the above imagined conversation bears to real or computer generated people is sheer coincidence. Again, this is pure satire and the product of my imagination.***
HT: Slice
![Image of The Prodigal God (An Unabridged Production)[2-CD Set]; Recovering the Heart of the Christian Faith](http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31Jl6fhDLxL._SL75_.jpg "The Prodigal God (An Unabridged Production)[2-CD Set]; Recovering the Heart of the Christian Faith")
49 Comments(+Add)
Very funny, Jerry. Good to have you back. Here are some comments that would fit.
THE TEMPLATE
Oh you are soooo right!
THE FLY-BY
Everyone here is an apostate.
THE CONTENTIOUS
I am right – you are wrong
THE REFORMER
Do you guys even know Luther?
THE CALVINIST
Sovereignty rules!
THE ARMINIAN
We must do more!
THE FRUSTRATED
I’m never commenting here again!
Thanks, Jerry for providing a sort of humorday. I would suggest we all look up “Classic Comments” here at crn.info. There is much treasure here!!
I actually found this post to be quite funny. Especially this part:
“One of the things that has always impressed me about CRN.info, is the willingness to allow any and all comments to appear in threads. When I first discovered this blog, it was like a breath of fresh air that the writers here do nothing to stifle conversation, nothing to prevent disagreement, nothing to censor those with whom they have differences. I have always appreciated that because more often than not what I have found is an opportunity for grace to flow freely and to be administered abundantly. Coming here and finding this kind of free flow of ideas and thoughts and grace was like walking into a flowered field after traipsing through a cow pasture.”
Must be a real slow day for you bozos.
You forgot Rike Matlock at selling his treasure, who would write posts about how those who disagree with him are not tolerant and liberal. Then when people might disagree with him he bans them unless they read his stuff but he sure does let his amen chorus through. The best part is, when people who don’t know Jesus show he up, he’s graceless.
It’s really something to see.
Jerry, while I appreciate the laugh (I mean, we ALL could be satirized, easily, and look silly!) I really don’t think the ODMs are going to take this the right way. It’ll probably be called slander or something like that or “putting a disclaimer at the end doesn’t make it right”, and in a way they would be right bout that.
It’s kind of in poor taste, don’t you think?
Plus, you don’t know exactly how comments on slice or CRN would go (yes they went that way in the past, but that won’t matter now that you’ve said all this lol, and there’s no more ‘proof’ of this because of course they’re all deleted), so it’s unfair to say we know all of their hearts and that the reason they don’t allow comments is because ““I have the only opinion that matters and I am unwilling to even consider that someone else may have feelings or thoughts invested in this.” ”
We can’t judge hearts, we always say that; and we can’t judge intentions, we always say that too. So we should be careful here. Right?
Joe,
Even if “Rike Matlock” reads that, it’s just going to be taken as an attack on him (true or not), and will not reconcile either of you, at all. You know that. In fact, I think that shows a lot of resentment on your part to post that comment, and maybe (I don’t know your heart, of course) a lack of forgiveness towards him for hurting you. I could be wrong, but that’s how it looks on the outside. Even if that’s not the case, it’ll still probably be taken ‘as fightin words!’ and will stall reconciliation further. Just some thoughts. Peace brothers.
Joe
Chris P….
Ahh forget it you wont listen and think name calling is a righteous thing to do…
Forget it… really…
It wouldn’t matter as you would just say something more distasteful and mean instead of truly looking in your own heart for the hate that you need to conquer by the Blood of Jesus.
Grace and the blessed love of Jesus to you,
iggy
Joe C,
You and I are going to have to disagree here. I’m not that concerned about being reconciled at the cost of not being able to proclaim the truth. Jesus showed the least amount of interest in reconciling with the religious leaders, especially, when that reconciliation came at the price of speaking the truth. Maybe if Rick Matlock existed and you found his blog you might be interested in reading what he had to say to a girl named Anya, then come back here and tell me if he represented the Jesus you know all that well.
Shame Chris, a real shame you must behave this way… we’ve tried to engage you in dialogue, but all we get is drive-by attacks, irrelevant comments, and now this… “bozos”? Please!
Neil
It must be an incredibly slow day for people to read these bozos!
We are free in Christ to disobey the Scriptures that speak about the tongue. When I am orthodox in my doctrine, I can behave anyway and claim God is on my side. It’s called:
“Bloggin in the Free World”.
Joe C.,
Thanks for the comment, but I respectfully disagree. First of all, this imagined conversation is imagined only because, to a certain extent, many of these very imagined comments have, in one way or another, been written right here at CRN.info.
Second, this is an imagined conversation spoken by an imaginary group of Scandanavian commentators. Any resemblance is bears to real or artificial people is purely coincidental.
Third, you may be right in saying that it is in poor taste. That’s quite how I felt when I read a version of it at SOL. I felt, how should I put this…dirty.
Chris P.,
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!
God’s Blessing be upon you, my friend.
jerry
I got some scars from the old days, Joe, wanna see ‘em?? That’s proof!! lol
You gave me a laugh just when I needed one, tnx Jerry
_ _ … …_ _
Ah it’s okay Jerry and Joe. If I’m wrong I’m wrong, I just wanted to share my thoughts, that’s all.
Jerry, if what slice did was in poor taste, why copy it at all? Like I said, it was funny, but was it the smartest thing to do? Aren’t we trying to try to find some way, any way, if at all possible, to have peace with the ODM crowd? Just sayin’…maybe this didn’t help? Unless that’s not our, or your goal. Then I’m sorry I brought it up
Joe M,
“Jesus showed the least amount of interest in reconciling with the religious leaders, especially, when that reconciliation came at the price of speaking the truth.”
But He died for them, and you. And think about this, reconciliation with someone, having a bond of peace, being merciful and forgiving to someone, and not continuing to take pot shots on someone’s character or lackthereof, does not mean you have to give up on the truth. That’s a false dichotomy, you know? Doing one doesn’t mean you have to forget the other. Shoudn’t we emulate the words of Jesus in doing to others what we would like done to us? Are you, or I, or any of us doing that daily, as we should?
“Maybe if Rick Matlock existed and you found his blog you might be interested in reading what he had to say to a girl named Anya, then come back here and tell me if he represented the Jesus you know all that well.”
It doesn’t matter if he does or not Joe, that shouldn’t change how you or I act towards him, treat him, and share God’s grace with him. It just doesn’t change a single thing.
If we don’t show love for our brothers and sisters, what do we have…?
I humbly think we should all think about this tonight…
Once again, if you disagree with me, that’s OK, just take it as me caring and looking out, and just sharin’ my thoughts.
Peace brothers,
Joe
Me too Scotty, me too. Scars abound. Forgive and forget though. Love keeps no record of wrongs.
(not sayin’ I’m very good at it or anything lol)
Joe
Joe C,
He also called them white washed tombs. I wonder what you would have said to Him if he had posted that.
jerry is truly a gifted man:
He has captured my precise thoughts about CRN.Info. Amazing.
Jesus knows all men’s hearts, out of all of us He is the only One who can speak directly in to another man’s heart and tell them exactly who and what they are.
Do you know all men’s hearts?
Since when was “Jesus said such and such to this type of person” an excuse to treat someone poorly?
Why are you fighting this so hard? And why are you insinuating that I’d be mad with Jesus for saying those things, knowing full well that I know He did?
Remember Joe, plenty of us have been treated just the same as you have been treated by them. Many of us. A lot of us feel like you do, but it’s how we act that’s going to make a big difference in all of this.
Joe
Joe C,
It’s irrelevant what you would have said to Jesus. I think you and I can just agree to disagree.
Peace
There – fixed it for you, Ken…
Joe C,
It looks as though we were posting at the same time. Please don’t lecture me like I’m some new buck private fresh out of basic. You and I are not going to agree on this one. You do what you feel you need to do and I’ll do what I feel I need to do. And we can both let God sort it out.
I’m not lecturing you Joe, how could I? Sheesh, I was just trying to have a conversation and sort out what’s okay and not okay to do. I hope you do realize you’re MUCH older than I am, and have known Christ much longer than I have, brother. Could it be possible that the younger people who are just starting out in all of this might just look up to the older people who have ‘done it’ longer? And we’re trying to figure out which direction to take things in? And when they see stuff like this, they get confused. That’s when the worries come, that’s when the questions come.
I’m just trying to care and take care. Maybe I’m just naive huh?
I can live with God sorting it out. Sorry to have bothered you Joe. You have a great night!
Joe
Joe C,
No bother at all. I just figure this conversation will go back and forth to the point that I’m ready to pull what little hair I have out and your rubbing your crew cut until your hands bleed. I have some pretty strong feelings about these men and women and the damage they do to the cause of Christ. For instance, they have said all along that if it could be proven they were lying about other people they would take the post down. Well, I’m finding that’s not true. It’s more about team politics, than about furthering the gospel. You and I agree on a lot, on this one we disagree.
Peace
Got it, Joe. Have a good night brother.
I’m going to believe Ingrid when she writes:
I realize, Jerry, this was satirical. But I’m going to believe the best about my sister.
Ken,
What I have yet to understand about ODM’s, even after all this time, is the general refusal to engage in meaningful conversation on any issue.
An ODM writes a blog. Often times it contains false/incorrect information (e.g. – the blog that incorrectly defined penal substitution), other times it contains guilt by association (e.g. – Warren having a book contract with a man whose company also produces questionable publications, therefore Warren is a pornographer), or arguments from silence (e.g. – Bell may have shared the Gospel, but he didn’t use [insert word], therefore he denies the Gospel).
In response one of use writes a blog pointing out logical fallacies and factual errors.
And in response to that he ODM SOP is to claim persecution and/or leave a hostile comment on the other persons blog… while refusing to allow comments on their own.
So the question remains… why not engage in a conversation as opposed to just being snarky?
Neil
I remember when Slice had comments. I even tried posting there. But if you disagreed you were sure NOT to be cleared through moderation – most of the time. Those who did agree were posted. So it was basically an amen-echo-chamber… with a few select disagreements.
In fact (it’s kinda funny in hind-sight), I remeber posting follow-up questions. I was not even disagreeing but just seeking more information and/or clarity. Even those were filtered out. Discussion was not an option. That’s when the “Sllice Shunned” banner became a badge of honor.
From Ingrid’s pov I understand that it would be overwhelming. It’s hard to filter out everyone who objects to anything you post.
Neil
I have posted a few things at Mike Ratliff’s blog and each has been deleted. He seems to love those posts that tell him how wonderful and gifted he is, though!
Mike Ratliff’s posts are so sad it borders on funny. It goes like this:
1. He posts
2. Paul and Luann tell him how wonderful he is.
3. He thanks them.
4. Josh Parker tells him how “dead on” he is
5. He thanks Josh
6. Someone disagrees.
7. Mike explains to the person how he’s never wrong and the person disagreeing must be wrong.
8. Same someone disagrees more
9. Same someone’s salvation is called into question and he/she is banned.
10. Paul and Luan, and Josh all sing a rousing chorus of “Amen Mike,”
Joe,
I’ll testify that I see something similar go on there, and that it’s personally happened to me. That’s all I’ll say though.
I can’t speak to the accuracy of Joe’s account of the process at Mike Ratcliff’s blog – I am unfamiliar with him.
But I will cross examine your testimony:
1. Has anyone hear questioned your salvation?
2. Have you been banned or filtered?
Neil
I can testify to Joe’s rendering of that blog. It is like clockwork .
1. No one who writes here has ever questioned my salvation. But I have been called every apostate name under the sun on most every ODM site that I have dared opened my mouth.
2. Never been banned or filtered from here. But have been from many other sites
Chad,
I suppose they could responsd that you have been treated this way because you are part of the amen chorus that agrees with the site.
Yet, those who disagree also post freely, have never been banned, not had their salvation questioned, etc…
It all comes back to two things really: 1) charitable reading, and 2) taking peoples faith claims at face value.
Neil
Neil,
I propose a third:
3 ) having a teachable spirit
Neil-
To my knowledge no one, disagree or not, has been banned from this site – certainly not for disagreeing, at least.
And if you haven’t noticed in the “Dressing Up” thread which has nothing to do with dressing up, I am not in agreement with one of the writers here – so no, I am not part of some “amen chorus.”
Nathanael,
I hope you would extend me the same good will as you have extended to your sister.
Ken,
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!
your friend, jerry
I’m glad that for the most part those responding to this thread understand the point of the post and have enjoyed a laugh or two.
The gist was boldfaced in the opening salvo: “They prefer, instead, to write up their opinions and not interact with anyone who may have a differing opinion. I think this is sad because in a way it is like saying, “I have the only opinion that matters and I am unwilling to even consider that someone else may have feelings or thoughts invested in this.””
Mike Ratliff makes me laugh, too.
jerry
Absolutely, Jerry.
That was my point… to show that there is disagreement and that it is “allowed”.
Apparently I need to check out Mike Ratliff’s blog…
I accept your proposal…
Unless someone challenges me to back up a stance I may take, I will never question it myself. It’s in the dialoguing and conversations that cause me to re-examine what I believe.
And that is when I grow.
I love the conversations on this site, even the ones that drag on to 400+ entries.
Jerry, I hope you didn’t take my statement to mean I was extending grace to Ingrid and not to you. I just choose to read things charitably and give everyone the benefit of the doubt. That’s all.
Shalom
Nathanael,
No worries.
jerry
Joe,
Comment 23(?) is what I found to be true… or he claims where you disagree is “off topic” so will not deal with it…
Like a post on Martin Luther where he then uses Luther as an example of being a great man of God, which he was… I pointed out he was an anti Semite/foul mouthed and crude fellow also… noting that in is often in our humanity God is great… not because of us but because he just is…
I was told that I was ad mouthing Luther and that I was off topic…
Whatever… Mike just likes to be right and never challenged… adn does pull the “you are not saved” card often…
iggy
Neil…
1. Yes
2. Yes
But not all of ‘them’ ( I use that loosely ) have done that to me either.
Sometimes it’s over basically nothing. Or disagreeing over complete non-essentials. I really don’t want to talk about it much, it’s just gossip to me.
Joe
If Mike R and Ken are both infallable as they seem to believe, what happens if they disagree?
They don’t disagree.
The same thing that happens if you happen to see your future self visiting you in the present. KABOOM.
Joe C.
In rereading you comments I find I misunderstood you. I thought you said the same things happened to you HERE – not there. That;s why I “cross-examined” you testimony.
Sorry ’bout the confusion.
Neil
It’s okay Neil.
for some reason I am pulled toward wiggy… I love that guy… he seems so full of grace and love… except when he is mean…
iggy
If only all Christians could get along so well! Good job guys. You set a fine example of Christian charity and grace!
jerry
iggy,
He is an enigmatic figure. In some ways, you might say, she is modeled after some people I know. I thought you might like him/her.
jerry