This is a quote from a CRN article on submitting to authority

Our Christianity does not give us the right to rebel against our superiors in the social structure no matter how unfair or harsh the conditions are.

I wonder if this would mean that we should submit to the authority of pastors who used a more purpose driven model in their communities. Or does all this submission mumbo-jumbo take a backseat to blogs that go on and one about the incompetency and ignorance of those we were once submitted to. Funny how submission flies out the door when we find ourselves in harsh conditions (translation: submission only happens when I agree with the authority).

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This entry was posted on Tuesday, September 2nd, 2008 at 4:56 pm and is filed under Hypocrisy, In Tone and Character, Linked Articles, Mike Ratliff, ODM Responses, ODM Writers. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
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37 Comments(+Add)

1   Rick Frueh
September 2nd, 2008 at 5:13 pm

Although I feel Mike is usually not as personal as others, how can a site like SoL which demeans and denigrates preachers and elders by name also teach humble submission? And how can a woman who attcks and confronts the husbands, much less the elders, of other women and then claim to believe in Biblical submission of wives? (hint-she can’t)

When a pastor is voted in, he his called at the pleasure and direction of the people. How can that be submission? Up until now I have participated on this blog as an equal, but now I must insist (humbly request) on total and unquestioned submission to my obvious authority. :evil:

2   chris
September 2nd, 2008 at 5:46 pm

unquestioned submission to my obvious authority.

Rick Frueh and Cartman are the same person! I knew it!

3   Chad
September 2nd, 2008 at 5:50 pm

We should not rebel against our superiors in the social structure because we are Christians? They must mean something else, right? Certainly they are not saying that MLK or Wilberforce or anyone else who stands up against the “moral majority” are wrong, are they?

4   Ken    
September 2nd, 2008 at 7:29 pm

Why did Ingrid get divorced, then?

5   Jerry Hillyer
September 3rd, 2008 at 8:08 am

I guess the Exodus was just a joke then right? Israel never should have rebelled against Egypt.

6   Rick Frueh
September 3rd, 2008 at 8:10 am

The American Revolution was absolutely unscriptural.

7   Nathanael
September 3rd, 2008 at 9:03 am

Jesus was the original revolutionary.
I’m glad He took upon Himself “the right to rebel against [the] superiors in the social structure no matter how unfair or harsh the conditions…”

8   Nathanael
September 3rd, 2008 at 9:14 am

In all fairness to Mike, I must say I commented above before reading his article. So my comment was in reference to this OP and the comments that followed.

Mike does, in his original article, make this statement:

Christ’s life is our example. He suffered for us and has left us to follow in His steps. Even though our Lord was treated harshly, He never retaliated in any way. Instead, He entrusted Himself to the Father who judges justly.

Amen, brother.

9   Rick Frueh
September 3rd, 2008 at 9:39 am

Nathan – may I gently suggest a spell check in the title? :)

10   Chris P.
September 3rd, 2008 at 11:29 am

Obedience is subjective, submission is absolute. There is a difference between the two;
e.g. in Acts 4 the apostles chose to obey God rather than the council. However they also had to submit to their authority and the consequences,i.e. imprisonment,beating, death or maybe all three. Many of them suffered a martyr’s death.
This is found to be so in other passages also.

As for MLK, was he even a christian?
He was a political activist.
Wilberforce was a believer and worked through the context of parliament in accordance to Acts13.

Say wwhat you will about the anerican revolution
The French revolution was worse, being completely unscriptural, and completely humanist in its context. It was post-modern before post-modernism was cool. It was pure evil.

The Exodus was a Hebrew revolt??
I seem to remember Yahweh sending 10 plagues, parting the Red Sea and drowning the Egyptian army.
This was/is His divine doing and choosing.

Finally… If Jesus was such a great revolutionary, then why was nothing changed in terms of Rome, the pharisees etc?
Why did he die? He did not come to overthrow the established order in His first advent.
He is coming, however, to do just that in the not so distant future? He is the King of all Kings, not Che Guvera or some anarchist, (a comparison I have read on the liberation theology blogs.)
I also tire of the early church being referred to as “world-changers” or that they” turned the world upside down” blah blah blah.
If so, how did the apsotate whore called the roman catholic church come into being.?
The great falling away was begnning even as Paul wrote about it to the Thessolonians, and has continued to this day. Why are things worse than ever? Don’t say that they are not.

Those who preach the golden calf of Jesus, the Ghandi of His time, are in revolt against God and His Word (both flesh and written), where He reveals Himself to us.

11   Chris P.
September 3rd, 2008 at 11:37 am

Correction, Wilberforce worked in accordance to ROMANS 13.

12   Cheeno    
September 3rd, 2008 at 1:59 pm

As an answer to your question, Ingrid is a hypocrite, that’s why. She drinks wine with dinner, goes to parties with her jazzer husband that she’d condemn in a church, and is attending a catholic college (see her personal blog). It’s obvious that there’s one side for the public and one in private. Nuff said.

13   nc    
September 3rd, 2008 at 2:39 pm

ai yi yi…

seriously…I’m no fan of the High Priestess and her Imam friends, but leave that divorce garbage alone…

that’s low.

however, that stuff Cheeno just listed is pretty legit.

14   Kim    
September 3rd, 2008 at 4:26 pm

That was a dirty punch. She told the story of it on her blog in four installments on domestic violence. There was also adultery involved. When someone\’s punching you, defying authority means rescuing your life. Nobody has the right to injure you or your kids. Cheeno, when did Ingrid say drinking was evil? The only thing I\’ve seen her write about is when churches turn themselves into clubs or their flaunting it as a selling point for church. She\’s Lutheran and most lutherans don\’t object to alcohol, it\’s the abuse of it that is sin. Why are you trying to smear her?

15   Ken Silva
September 3rd, 2008 at 6:44 pm

Kim is right that stuff re. Ingrid is a low blow and CRN.Info should be ashamed of itself for indulging such unChristian comments without formal rebuke.

But this is in error: “She\’s Lutheran”… Actually the Schluters currently attend a Lutheran church but Ingrid is not Lutheran, her husband is.

16   nc    
September 3rd, 2008 at 7:39 pm

RE: …low blow and CRN.Info should be ashamed of itself for indulging such unChristian comments without formal rebuke.

huh, “…leave that divorce garbage alone…

that’s low. didn’t register?

And talk about picking nits…”she’s not Lutheran, her husband is”…

ai yi yi

17   Cheeno    
September 3rd, 2008 at 7:53 pm

Hey don’t yell at me, I was just responding to the original Ken’s comment. I personally saw the Schlueters at a downtown restaurant in our city which I could name but won’t and there was a bottle of pinot noir on their table –I was 8 feet away– and a glass at each plate in front of them and she drank from hers so any anti-booze stuff won’t ring true for me. Don’t ask me how I know the rest. I don’t hate Ingrid – actually I used to love her from a distance. So am i bitter, yeah. I was apparently too white trash for her tastes. Elitism isn’t very Christian, I don’t think.

18   nc    
September 3rd, 2008 at 8:52 pm



You could always start a watch-blog about your “favorite” public figure.


19   Cheeno    
September 3rd, 2008 at 9:14 pm

I don’t recommend that idea. I was already called a stalker just because I sent her a Josh Groban CD one Valentine’s Day a long time ago along with a card. Seriously what’s wrong with that? I even dedicated “Broken Vow” to her on the Delilah show. She doesn’t know it, LOL. I’m a sore loser, but I stand by the hypocrite thing.

20   nc    
September 3rd, 2008 at 9:24 pm


ha! somebody is kidding themselves…


21   Cheeno    
September 3rd, 2008 at 10:09 pm

It was her husband who came up with the stalker word when she got the cd. It was kind of a misunderstanding there. Broken Vow is a beautiful song by Groban though. If you haven’t heard it you should. It’s on YouTube. I don’t wanna be a hater. I’ll just remember those amazing blue eyes and think about what a hypocrite she is cause it makes me feel better.

22   Rick Frueh
September 3rd, 2008 at 10:14 pm

Lara Fabian sings the song Broken Vow as well. Very good voice.

What is pinot noir?

23   Cheeno    
September 3rd, 2008 at 10:19 pm

Pino noir is a kind of red wine. Good with steaks by the way.

24   iggy
September 3rd, 2008 at 10:24 pm

No offense Cheeno… I am just having trouble picturing Ingrid as a heart breaker… I am sure she is to someone… but in my mind I just can’t get that picture…


25   Cheeno    
September 3rd, 2008 at 10:35 pm

Iggy – have you ever met her in person? You have no idea what your saying.

26   iggy
September 3rd, 2008 at 10:38 pm

Still not getting the picture and not sure I want to… I am very happy with my wife she’s got it going all over Ingrid…

and she is much nicer.


27   Kim    
September 3rd, 2008 at 11:07 pm

No offense Iggy, but I\’ve seen her husband\’s picture and judging by that photo of yours, he has it all over on you. And much nicer.

28   iggy
September 3rd, 2008 at 11:11 pm


You never met me in person… I am much nicer, and really I care less how you think I look like… If you are offended I am more attracted to my wife than Ingrid… well there is not much more I can say to you… My wife thinks I am great looking… and really that is what matters…

So, Ingrid has a good looking husband… which btw I also could care less about as she is his wife… I hope he is attracted to her… I also hope they are very happy together and have a blessed marriage.



29   Rick Frueh
September 3rd, 2008 at 11:13 pm

Let us leave the adolescent courtyard and return to Christian issues.

30   iggy
September 3rd, 2008 at 11:23 pm


Are you jealous of Ingrid or me for having great looking spouses?



31   Chad
September 4th, 2008 at 12:01 am

As for MLK, was he even a christian?

I am sure you can tell us, Chris P.

32   iggy
September 4th, 2008 at 12:13 am


This I know for sure, Ingrid is most likely very happy I am not attracted to her… LOL!

Now no where have I stated she is ugly… just that I have a hard time seeing her as a heart breaker.


33   Ken    
September 4th, 2008 at 12:39 am

Ingrid is a very attractive woman, and in her youth she found the “goddess power” that can come to women of a certain charm and beauty.

Furthermore, Ingrid realized that she could control men like pet dogs – until one of her subjects, her first husband, rebelled wretchedly against the exercise of her uniquely feminine power, using physical and emotional violence against the suffering Norse goddess.

Did anyone read the comments – closely – in her four part series on the domestic abuse situation?

More than one commenter referenced goddess worship in various linked pages.

Submission to authority is an idea that Ingrid detests. Why then, is she so tolerating of Mike R., Ken S., et al?

Ingrid is not only beautiful, she is intelligent. These circle of men have been put in place by her to do her bidding. Weak minded men who cannot see the larger strategy are useful tools and serve a purpose even if they sometimes blunder onto a painful topic.

Through these men, Ingrid hopes to gain the love and admiration from conservative Christians, and “suffer” for Christ by way of her many persecutors.

34   iggy
September 4th, 2008 at 1:09 am


I think you are pushing it a little too far… even for me…


35   BCP    
September 4th, 2008 at 5:21 am

Hi all,

Can we stop discussing Ingrid – her looks, divorce, etc…?



36   Opus    
September 4th, 2008 at 3:57 pm

This comment thread has turned completely creepy.Please stop.Thanks,

37   Eugene Roberts
September 4th, 2008 at 4:03 pm

Ken, you are way out of line. Please stop.