Source: Emerging Thought in Montana

Comments: After the accidental electrocution of Kyle Lake, SoL decided to make hay of his death as “God’s Judgement” on Kyle’s faulty theology, and to say of themselves, “Thank God I am not a sinner like him…”. Iggy takes note and weeps.

Memorable Quotes:

I am not sure how to respond, or even if I should to the people who seem to think God is killing those whom in their own eyes are heretics.

I think Kyle Lake was far from a heretic.

Now, what I do see is this.

There are some whom seem to have placed themselves as the Judges of not just sinners but of fellow Christian brothers and sisters. Then they use, or rather misused scripture to back up their twisted belief system.

First off I do not want to give the impression I knew Kyle. In fact I can’t remember hearing about him until this tragic event happened. I almost let it slide by until I came across some anti emergent people mocking his passing and claiming God was getting those emergent heretics. This left me stone cold. How can a brother be so filled with hate that they rejoice in another’s pain and sorrow? Jesus even taught to pray for our enemies, and yet, these people claiming Jesus, laugh and seem to rejoice in a brother in Christ’s passing.

I am sick of the Ingrid’s and Paul Proctors of this world who to me are hatemonger’s and stand on nothing but their own self righteousness and judgmentalism. I am sick of people like Pat Robertson who condemn entire cities in the name of Jesus, and forget He died for their sin as well as PR’s.

My prayers are with the congregation at University Baptist Church in Waco, Texas. May Kyle’s life be an example of Christ that one can cherish and carry as one grows in faith.

My prayers are also for those who preach hate, that the true Light of Christ be found and the hate in your hearts be displaced with the LOVE of Christ for God first then for your brothers… but until then, don’t call me brother. (John 18:19, John 8:42-45)

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Source: Emerging Thought in Montana

Comments: Iggy waxes poetical on the bitter Slice of Laodicea and its continued Schadenfreude in the matter of Kyle Lake.
Memorable Quotes:

You can read Ingrid and laugh,

You can read her and cry,

You can read her and even wonder why?

Yet, mostly I read her and think,

There, but by God’s grace…

go I.


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Source: Bob Blog

Comments: Bob documents the beginnings of the ‘good’ emergentno (as opposed to the bad one), and the addition of Slice to its RSS feed.

Here, Bob also documents a known flaw in Slice’s blacklisting protocol which blacklists thousands of people who have never even commented, but whose internet service is through a proxy server (in this case, Starbucks/T-Mobile).
Memorable Quotes:

I know that all of this is probably counter-productive in the long run (in the sense that we should probably just ignore critics who don’t have our best interest at heart and are unable to comment on anything positive in amongst all the finger pointing…), but…

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Source: Bob Blog

Comments: Bob says a prayer for Ken, Ingrid and company, after a slanderous categorization of the church movement to which he belongs.
Memorable Quotes:

Ahh… see now… now we’re actually “satanic.”

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Source: Musings from Two-Sheds Gomer

Comments: Brendt attended an incredibly worshipful night with Michael W. Smith, Third Day and others.   The sin?  It was sponsored by Chevy.  Therefore, according to I Hezekiah (or at least Steve Camp), worship could not have happened there.  Brendt takes issue with this assessment.
Memorable Quotes:

Not content to simply allow something like this to happen, there were voices of dissent because (in an uncommon move) the tour was sponsored by Chevrolet. No voice was louder than that of Steve Camp. In his analysis of the situation, Camp begins by stating that “I want to affirm my love and prayers for Michael W. Smith, Third Day, and Max Lucado”, then proceeds to cruficy them. (See also, “with friends like these…”) This tactic does not seem to be uncommon for Camp, who also will make self-effacing remarks about his past, and then rip someone else’s present. I guess that Camp considers himself to have arrived and that Galatians 6:1 is not applicable.

… if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness …

This, of course, assumes that Camp is one of the “you who are spiritual”. But I digress.

Camp’s polemic is filled with strawmen, largely based (apparently) on some divine knowledge of others’ attitudes, thoughts, and feelings. Where non-existent (and therefore, very easily refuted) issues are not employed, mischaracterizations of situations and misinterpretations (or, at least, misapplication) of Scripture is used. One example would be the statement:

The fact that this is an “evening of worship and evangelism” — their language, not mine -means that we have now actually digressed to charging people money to worship the Lord.

Uh, no, Steve. “We” are charging people money to be a part of a particular event during which there is the hope and prayer that worship will take place. Just like I was charged money for your concerts back in the 80s. Even if this is dismissed as Camp’s past, he is alleging that I was incapable of achieving genuine worship at his concerts. I’m not sure who this insults the most — me, Camp, or God. And lest we classify this as solely the past, please be aware that Camp participated in a cruise earlier this year, for which people were charged a lot more than my ticket to that concert cost. By Camp’s argument, no worship must have occured on that ship either.

Camp quotes these verses…

1 Corinthians 1:18
For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

John 15:18-19
18 If the world hates you, you know that it hated Me before it hated you.
19 If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.

…and then uses them to claim that any level of acceptability in the world means that the Christian is doing something wrong. The converse to this argument is that disfavor by the world indicates that you’re doing something right. But it could just mean that you’re a booger-head

But, let’s not rely on my interpretation. I’ll close with one more Scripture.

Isaiah 55:11
So shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth; It shall not return to Me void, But it shall accomplish what I please, And it shall prosper in the thing for which I sent it.

In short, you can’t get in God’s way, even if you try.

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Source: The Mindful Mission
Comments: Dave has a short post on the nuttiness that is Slice.  In his comments section, which is where the meat of this is at, a picture of Slice emereges in living color.
Memorable Quotes:

I don’t know of a blog that angers me more than this one. Yet I still read it – and no, I am not really sure why. Probably for the same reasons that I listen to Michael Savage.

How someone can both use the Bible to criticize certain areas of the church and be filled with such hatred and bigotry towards other Christians is beyond me.

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Source: Cerulean Sanctum
Comments: Dan posts some practical observations on how to deal with perceived heresy, which is a manner – almost point-by-point – ignored by the ‘heretic hunters’ in the Christian blogosphere. While he does not call out Slice, specifically, everything he says, applies.
Memorable Quotes:

Anyone who wishes to confront heresy needs to have an exceedingly well-ordered house with nary a pane of glass in sight. Jesus used a strong word here—hypocrite—and He means it. This necessitates great humility on the part of anyone confronting another because we must come to grips with our own sinfulness before we confront a lapsed brother. In other words, a gleeful slashing at an opponent is sinful. No one who confronts heretics should do so if they find it to be enjoyable or a source of self-worth. Too many times that is the spirit I see at work in those who seek to topple heretics. Remember that the criteria used against heretics will be the criteria used against those who confront them.

The upshot of this is if we go off half-cocked, lacking understanding as to what our opponents are saying exactly, then we bear false witness against them when we accuse them of impropriety. But too often our accusations are just that—uninformed. A wise man listens, understands, then speaks. A fool speaks without understanding.

Are we spending any time truly understanding what potential heretics are saying or do we shoot first and ask questions later? If the latter, then we are no better than those we accuse because we are bearing false witness against them.

Recently, I counted at least four blogs I read that cited a mainstream newspaper article profiling a well-known pastor in Michigan. Those blogs tore into that pastor based on what was in the newspaper article. One of those blogs even slammed the pastor because the newspaper reporter elected to refer to him as “the hottest preacher in Michigan,” as if the pastor had any control over the editorial license of the reporter!

The problem with newspapers and other forms of the mainstream media (MSM) is—and unless your name is “Rip Van Winkle” you should know this—they are not always reliable sources. How many times in the last five years has an award-winning reporter fudged the facts on a story or twisted them to make the story more compelling? Do we remember the recent editorial bloodletting at The New York Times?

Personal confrontation also has a sharpening quality. The famous “Iron sharpens iron, and one man sharpens another” from Proverbs 27:17 implies that there is some dullness to begin with. If we do not confront personally, how will they be sharpened? Even more so, how will we be sharpened if we fail to faithfully bring that personal confrontation?

I have said in other places on Cerulean Sanctum that those we find to be in error are often so because they are reacting badly to something we ourselves did wrong or failed to do at all. The way that some pervert the Gospel also shows us where we have failed to defend the portion being perverted. This is to our shame as much as it is to theirs.

Is that our aim when we confront heretics? Do we really wish to see them abandon their heresy and return to God, or do we wish to see them consigned to hell? I know which one gives the Lord more pleasure.

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Source: Cerulean Sanctum
Comments: Dan notes a number of ‘explosions’ on the Christian Blogosphere, of which Slice played a part in several, and then offered counsel on remembering that there ARE people out there on the other end of the text messages…
Memorable Quotes:

Folks, a name and a postage stamp-sized pic on the Web is not a person. You don’t know me and I really don’t know you, either. It’s easy to tear out someone’s heart on the Web through our pseudo-anonymity. It is far harder to tear out someone’s heart in person. But when we get right down to it, the Lord would not have us savage each other on the Web anymore than He would condone us savaging each other in person.

Can we all just take a deep breath and hold it for a few seconds? Can we count to ten before we post the latest flame bait or character assassination. I’m tired of the hunt for heretics. Cerulean Sanctum gets more combined hits from people looking for heretics than any other kind of Google search. That’s really sad.

Is this all we are about? I’ve blogged many times about this, but it’s getting stupid now and I’m questioning why we Christians even blog if this is all we can do.

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Source: Cerulean Sanctum
Comments: Dan takes to task a number of (unnamed) Christian bloggers who call out who the heretics are and consign them to hell – maybe even taking perverse pleasure in doing so.
Memorable Quotes:

The Christian blogosphere talks about hell far more than you’ll hear from any pulpit. I’ve read just about every take on hell you can imagine in just the last few weeks. But every one of those theological treatises has ignored one kind of hell, the hell that most people experience: hell on earth.

It doesn’t take much for us Christians to castigate anyone we deem to be unworthy sinners. You don’t have to look very far to find such horrid heathens. The Christian blogosphere is brimming over with posts that name names and point fingers. The names of the enemies change, but the general collection of them remains the same. You’re likely to find homosexuals, evolutionists, atheists, and the ACLU in that category. Karl Rove seems to occupy that spot for Sojourners types, while the hardcore conservatives still get mileage out of Bill Clinton. And then there’s whatever preacher or teacher we love to hate. Benny Hinn, Rick Warren, Joyce Meyer, Ken Copeland—maybe even your own pastor will show up on that list, who knows. The important thing here is that hell needs to be invoked whenever we think about them.

More and more I believe that we truly want to see some people burn in hell. It used to be the Hitlers, Pol Pots, and Stalins of the world, but increasingly it’s the people we disagree with—you know, The Enemies of Christ. And from the dialog I see occurring on an increasing number of Christian Web sites, I believe that there are a few too many Christians who would get no more glee than to have a front row seat in Abraham’s bosom so they can stare out over the chasm that separates heaven from hell and lob a few jeers at the prisoners of hell. Because we all know that nothing hurts worse than to be in hell and have to suffer the receiving end of cat-calls from The People Who Got It Right.

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Source: Cerulean Sanctum
Comments: Dan reminds Christian bloggers how perceived heresy should be approached, and doles out some barbs for those who might not be listening all too well…
Memorable Quotes:

So here’s what I’m saying in a nutshell:

  • If you insist that people must be exactly {miscellaneous Christian necessity}, but you are doing nothing concrete to help them achieve {miscellaneous Christian necessity}, then SHUT UP.
  • If you believe that {miscellaneous Christian ministry/teacher/author/pastor} is doctrinally wrong in some area, take a moment to ask if what he/she/it is saying in another area is something you need to hear before you call him/her/it heretical, or else SHUT UP.

I’m not willing to do the millstone thing. Have I done it in the past? Even on this blog? Probably. But folks, if we are truly going to be the Church, then we have got to start burying the hatchet in something besides each other, especially if we can only point out problems, but have no solutions. That kind of hypocrisy gets us nowhere.

Honestly, has anyone in the Evangelical, Reformed, Mainline, or Whatever Church who has ripped the Emerging Church lately taken one second to say, “You know, they do that a lot better than we do. Perhaps we need to improve in that area,” or is it just one tirade after another, with closed ears and a heart unwilling to take the correction God may be doling out through the equivalent of Balaam’s ass?

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